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Thread: TRT vs cycle

  1. #1
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    TRT vs cycle

    Hey guys.

    39 year old male. Married with 2 kids. Vasectomy. Have trained over the last 20 years for strength and my own ego to look and feel better. No interest in bodybuilding shows.

    183 cms. Used to run at 80kg lean (around 10% bf) 9 out of 12 months. Last 5 years to 10 years dropped the fasting, upped carbs and although I never got quite as lean, had abs around 90kg. Also found that full time work, 2 young kids led to poor sleep, habitual drinking, sloppy diet creeping in more and more. Found my self spending 9 out of 12 months out of shape now. Somewhere around 100kgs with very feint abs.

    Pbs around 180kg deadlift, 130kg squat for 5 reps, 110kg bench, row 100kg, chin bw plus 40kg.

    History of mpb, on finastride last 10 years.

    Always believed topping up testosterone at 40 years plus was a smart move for health, longetivity, prevention of gradual decline. Was all set up to start self TRT to put myself up top of normal... Till someone pointed out lifelong reliance on UGL not smart. The more I considered, the more I agreed. Unfortunately, being prescribe testosterone in Australia (AFAIK) is very difficult.

    I then considered running high TRT (175mgs) for a cycle, but further reading teaches me I'll have all the same issues coming off as a full cycle.

    So, I'm now considering a low dose safe cycle. Im interested in minimizing sides (including hair loss considering my history). Weighing up about 350mg to 400mg test e or c for around 16 weeks with perhaps aromasin 12mg per day. Wondering about lowering this to 250mg and adding 100 to 150mg of something else? Where I'm getting stuck is sourcing and paying for perfect pct in Australia. It seems to be international shipping with more risk and triple the price of the steroids themselves.

    Ultimately although I love training, I am motivated by progress and results, which will get harder and harder to come by as I head into my 40s. Main goal is to stay healthy but stack the odds in my favor and improve on my previous best results. In turn I believe this will reduce my drinking and other poor habits that have crept in (I realize I'm open to possible criticism here, but I know myself and how I work)

    So, after all that info (excuse the detail but a lot of posts ask for more info) my choices are.

    Jump on UGL TRT at 200mg ish long term - pros and cons? Anyone done same? It is very tempting to not have to PCT

    Cycle? Recommend in Australia is ozshop, waiting for a new list. Amounts and compunds to be as safe as possible? definitely didn't see everything listed in the perfect pct protocol.

    Feels like a huge decision and not something I want to get wrong hence asking. At the same time, I get that perhaps my options are, as listed above, and no one can decide for me so I just have to bite the bullet.

    Very open to people who have been through this before me and value your opinion

    Thanks very much

  2. #2
    Growing Brother hugeNelson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waitedtwentyyears View Post
    Hey guys.

    39 year old male. Married with 2 kids. Vasectomy. Have trained over the last 20 years for strength and my own ego to look and feel better. No interest in bodybuilding shows.

    183 cms. Used to run at 80kg lean (around 10% bf) 9 out of 12 months. Last 5 years to 10 years dropped the fasting, upped carbs and although I never got quite as lean, had abs around 90kg. Also found that full time work, 2 young kids led to poor sleep, habitual drinking, sloppy diet creeping in more and more. Found my self spending 9 out of 12 months out of shape now. Somewhere around 100kgs with very feint abs.

    Pbs around 180kg deadlift, 130kg squat for 5 reps, 110kg bench, row 100kg, chin bw plus 40kg.

    History of mpb, on finastride last 10 years.

    Always believed topping up testosterone at 40 years plus was a smart move for health, longetivity, prevention of gradual decline. Was all set up to start self TRT to put myself up top of normal... Till someone pointed out lifelong reliance on UGL not smart. The more I considered, the more I agreed. Unfortunately, being prescribe testosterone in Australia (AFAIK) is very difficult.

    I then considered running high TRT (175mgs) for a cycle, but further reading teaches me I'll have all the same issues coming off as a full cycle.

    So, I'm now considering a low dose safe cycle. Im interested in minimizing sides (including hair loss considering my history). Weighing up about 350mg to 400mg test e or c for around 16 weeks with perhaps aromasin 12mg per day. Wondering about lowering this to 250mg and adding 100 to 150mg of something else? Where I'm getting stuck is sourcing and paying for perfect pct in Australia. It seems to be international shipping with more risk and triple the price of the steroids themselves.

    Ultimately although I love training, I am motivated by progress and results, which will get harder and harder to come by as I head into my 40s. Main goal is to stay healthy but stack the odds in my favor and improve on my previous best results. In turn I believe this will reduce my drinking and other poor habits that have crept in (I realize I'm open to possible criticism here, but I know myself and how I work)

    So, after all that info (excuse the detail but a lot of posts ask for more info) my choices are.

    Jump on UGL TRT at 200mg ish long term - pros and cons? Anyone done same? It is very tempting to not have to PCT

    Cycle? Recommend in Australia is ozshop, waiting for a new list. Amounts and compunds to be as safe as possible? definitely didn't see everything listed in the perfect pct protocol.

    Feels like a huge decision and not something I want to get wrong hence asking. At the same time, I get that perhaps my options are, as listed above, and no one can decide for me so I just have to bite the bullet.

    Very open to people who have been through this before me and value your opinion

    Thanks very much
    Welcome to evolutionary!

    If you jump on TRT there is no going back. I would suggest 1 year on a self trt with PCT cycle before considering going full TRT, it's a serious choice. Might be hard to go back.

    is it possible to get real TRT in Australia? like doctor prescribed.

    In terms of cycle, 400mgs of testosterone enanthate 12.5mgs aromasin with 30-50mgs of anavar is a good combo. Preworkout to get pumps and energy cardio boost use cardazol 3 caps it's OTC. Try that for 12 weeks then pct after. I'm sure you can get some n2generate es ordered fairly easy, same with tamoxifen (nolvadex) and aromasin, stack them for pct.

  3. #3
    Growing Brother LordEscanor's Avatar
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    If You are looking for a safe cycle steroid is not for you. There is no safe cycle, some are less risky than others but all the same. Liver tumor, Infertility, ED, and the chance is not small by any means. And you gotta live with that for the rest of your life.
    Correct me if I am wrong but it seems like you are more concerned with staying lean and fit. If that's the case try stimulant that suppress appetite. And try your best fixing your sleep and diet. Taking steroid with poor sleep and diet means you are gonna get all the side effects and very few of the benefits.

  4. #4
    EVO V.I.P. MONSTRO's Avatar
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    There is no safe cycle because sometimes people try use weak compounds but since they dont work great they up dosages and this can be the same as using trenbolone and superdrol at very low dosages . Thats why i prefer use strong compounds and use very low dosages . There is no PCT , because when you stop using you lose all . This is a way without comeback , think very well about it because when you go in you will never go out. To look huge you need gear and to keep lloking huge you need gear to .

  5. #5
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    Thanks very much.

    This makes a lot of sense to me...

    Try self TRT for 12 months then PCT off, decide whether the perceived benefits of being the very top end of physiological testosterone translate into real life benefits. If they do, consider continuing, perhaps even with a doctor depending on blood results around the PCT.

    I could also try a blast, similar to what you listed, within that same 12 months so that I am really informed about how I want to continue.

    My only question/worry about this approach is wether success of PCT is much poorer after a year of TRT (say 150mg approx) with a 12 week blast included (say 400mg plus 30mg anavar)?

    Much appreciated,

  6. #6
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    Thanks for replying.

    You are right, I am more interested in being lean than huge (still looking for shape though) ...and I totally agree, my beliefs are that TRT that puts you at the top of physiological is safe and beneficial, whilst cycles begin to compromise health.

    I guess where I got stuck was the permanency of TRT without a doc on board, that lead to thoughts of a short self administered TRT trial, but considering shut down will be the same bumping the levels up to low dose cycle level seems too tempting/better bang for buck.

    I'm an on or off person...and I'd certainly work very hard to get sleep, cut out all alcohol, nail diet if I was trying this.

    As long as PCT after 12 months is not an issue I'd be tempted to proceed as I replied to huge Nelson..

    Appreciate the help

  7. #7
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    Sorry guys, I'm hitting the reply arrow but this doesn't seem to be putting the replies underneath the original comment.

    Monstro, thanks for replying.

    I appreciate the input. I definitely do not want to end up in a place where I am taking large amounts or very strong AAS and feeling trapped that I can never stop. As I replied to the fellas above... that's why I generally aligned with TRT sports doseages until I hit the stumbling blocks of it being permanent and being reliant on UGL.

    Provided I can PCT off a TRT trial with perhaps one small blast to get a feel for what I'm dealing with I can hopefully make smart choices (being cognisant of points such as yours not to fall into the trap of lager and larger does)

    Cheers

  8. #8
    Staff Writer LevButlerov's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waitedtwentyyears View Post
    Thanks very much.

    This makes a lot of sense to me...

    Try self TRT for 12 months then PCT off, decide whether the perceived benefits of being the very top end of physiological testosterone translate into real life benefits. If they do, consider continuing, perhaps even with a doctor depending on blood results around the PCT.

    I could also try a blast, similar to what you listed, within that same 12 months so that I am really informed about how I want to continue.

    My only question/worry about this approach is wether success of PCT is much poorer after a year of TRT (say 150mg approx) with a 12 week blast included (say 400mg plus 30mg anavar)?

    Much appreciated,
    Every time you run a long cycle, PCT becomes harder and harder, that's factual. But it's not impossible. If you can do it, you should pct for a full 8-10 weeks and get yourself as close to recovery as you can.

    I would shy away from doing self TRT if you're not sure you're willing to do it for life, and if you are then goto the doctor and push him to get you on TRT.
    Lev Butlerov - Evolutionary.org Staff Author
    Lev Butlerov holds a Masters Degree in Biology, he is NASM Certified, ISSA Certified, The National Council on Strength & Fitness (NCSF) certified and is currently working on his American Council on Exercise (ACE) certificate.

  9. #9
    Moderator stevesmi's Avatar
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    1. if your body produces test on its own free of charge then why mess around with that?
    2. i cannot believe you are on finasteride for 10 years! look into the long term risks, i never recommend messing with it
    Masters degrees in science-human nutrition/psychology
    Now taking clients for 1 on 1 consults
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  10. #10
    EVO V.I.P. BodyMonster34's Avatar
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    bro TRT for poosies, real men have high test on own

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