Is it possible to cycle with higher doses of Testosterone?

[normalkev]

Hey all,

I’m 41, 160 lbs at 13-14% bf. I am on TRT at 170 mg per week and am currently doing my first blast with 200 mg nandrolone for 14 weeks. I’m only on week two so I don’t feel anything but realize my dose is low and only expect to put on 5-6 lbs muscle at the end. That’s fine with me as my goal is just to look fit and look decent for my age. I plan on dropping some BF over the summer and am thinking of running another blast but with a little higher test and nandrolone.

Problem is I have pre existence gyno and am wondering if it’s possible to run higher test doses between 250-500 with an AI? I’m thinking of running a 14 week cycle with test at 250 or 300 and nandrolone at 300. I’ve been at 200 on my TRT without my gyno flaring but I have terrible mood issues with depression, anxiety at that dose.

Would it be better to run a 2nd cycle after this with just 170 test and 300 nandrolone or bump up my test to 250 or 300 with an AI and nandrolone at 300? Would there be a big difference in muscle gain if I increased the test along with the nandrolone?

 

[Phill]

since when did 500 mg become high dosages?

this is little more than a cruise for many

I don't see anything wrong with it, but do your blood works and check your estro

 

[normalkev]

Sorry, I should have asked is it possible to cycle with existing gyno with higher test doses?

 

[~Vision~]

This seems to be something that a lot of people misunderstand and that is increasing the dosages of peds. AAS does not make you grow or put on size, your nutrients will. AAS does other things that compliment the entire process.
the dosage you were on for your testosterone replacement therapy is not too bad however I do not know what your serum looks like or your free test levels.
There is ways to promote more growth by optimizing the amount of free testosterone in your system without increasing your dosages. Free bio test is what you want to focus on. You can simply add something very modest like Masteron E at 200mg E6D, this will help reduce the activity of estrogen by converting your bound testosterone into free usable testosterone, ultimately hijacking exogenous test, this will help lower your shbg levels at the same time controlling the amount of circulating estrogen and the conversion.
It's often mistaken as being called an anti-estrogen, when an actuality it's not really that, it just inhibits the process by a different pathway.
This will amplify your testosterone levels and your output and your sense of well-being. All the while staying within the same markers that you are prescribed.
Higher dosages of testosterone does not necessarily mean greater gains, you could be inviting a slew of unwanted side effects.
One of the number one things that people should focus on more is trying to grow while using as gear as possible. Knowing how to time your nutrients and your macros when your body needs them at the appropriate time is the most important thing of all. You can increase your dosages all day long and still be stuck in the same place, maybe slightly moving the scale because of water retention.
You owe it to yourself with putting this concept into great consideration. What do you have to lose?
If you pull a baseline blood work and then a post blood work running the protocol above I guarantee you'll see a huge difference not only on the analysis but also physically.

 

[brandontx]

200 mg of deca in top of my trt dose was my first blast ever. I put quite a bit of size on after about 4 months. Took about 10 weeks to notice but had a crazy month of growth after than where I noticed weekly changes. My training and nutrition was 100% dialed in at the time. Too bad it's not anymore. Lol. Coronavirus has fucked up my mojo.

 

[normalkev]

This seems to be something that a lot of people misunderstand and that is increasing the dosages of peds. AAS does not make you grow or put on size, your nutrients will. AAS does other things that compliment the entire process.
the dosage you were on for your testosterone replacement therapy is not too bad however I do not know what your serum looks like or your free test levels.
There is ways to promote more growth by optimizing the amount of free testosterone in your system without increasing your dosages. Free bio test is what you want to focus on. You can simply add something very modest like Masteron E at 200mg E6D, this will help reduce the activity of estrogen by converting your bound testosterone into free usable testosterone, ultimately hijacking exogenous test, this will help lower your shbg levels at the same time controlling the amount of circulating estrogen and the conversion.
It's often mistaken as being called an anti-estrogen, when an actuality it's not really that, it just inhibits the process by a different pathway.
This will amplify your testosterone levels and your output and your sense of well-being. All the while staying within the same markers that you are prescribed.
Higher dosages of testosterone does not necessarily mean greater gains, you could be inviting a slew of unwanted side effects.
One of the number one things that people should focus on more is trying to grow while using as gear as possible. Knowing how to time your nutrients and your macros when your body needs them at the appropriate time is the most important thing of all. You can increase your dosages all day long and still be stuck in the same place, maybe slightly moving the scale because of water retention.
You owe it to yourself with putting this concept into great consideration. What do you have to lose?
If you pull a baseline blood work and then a post blood work running the protocol above I guarantee you'll see a huge difference not only on the analysis but also physically.

Thank you for the response. I am/was a high SHBG guy starting TRT. I believe my shbg was around 75-80 about two years ago. Been on TRT for 2 years and my last blood draw put me at around 48 free test and 35 shbg and total test off the charts. I felt horrible because of higher estrogen so I decided to drop my dose to 170. It’s much better but I still take .125 anastrozel every 2-3 days. Have not pulled bloods since I made the change about 3.5-4 weeks ago.

Diet is in check, eat 300 above TDEE, high carb (350 gram plus), high protein around 180-200 and the rest fat. Make sure to eat plenty of carbs pre workout, during and post to control cortisol. Currently doing an upper/lower split 4x per week with 2 separate ab sessions per week. Definitely making progress but I’m not in my 20s to spend years trying to build a physique. Since I started late I am looking for a boost.

Do you think it would be better to keep my TRT as is and run Deca at 300 for my next blast or drop the deca and add mast? Thanks for the advise.

 

[normalkev]

200 mg of deca in top of my trt dose was my first blast ever. I put quite a bit of size on after about 4 months. Took about 10 weeks to notice but had a crazy month of growth after than where I noticed weekly changes. My training and nutrition was 100% dialed in at the time. Too bad it's not anymore. Lol. Coronavirus has fucked up my mojo.

Awesome, looking forward to making some gains on the 200 deca. I was told it will take about 6-7 weeks to build up in my system. I’m at week 2 so I’m getting anxious for it to start working.

 

[Mobster]

You do need to address the gyno issue. Have a look at our Anti-gyno protocol

 

[ElevenBravo77]

Some guys will say that's not enough but it's all about how you react to the compounds and what your goals are.

You should be able to increase your test dose you'll just likely have to take an AI if you are prone to gyno. My TRT dose is 100mg week and that puts my total Test in the 600-700 range. If I go even up to 200-250mg I need a little AI to keep gyno in check. At 500mg week of test I need 10mg aromasim daily where some guys still don't need any AI at that dose.

Even though your Nandrolone is low you may want caber on hand just in case and running 25mg of Proviron a day would be beneficial.

As far as gains not coming yet, Deca is a long ester so it takes longer to get in your system and start noticing the effects. And with 200mg the gains will be more slow and steady.

 

[stevesmi]

Problem is I have pre existence gyno and am wondering if it’s possible to run higher test doses between 250-500 with an AI?
?

this is where experience and bloodwork and trial and error come into play. there is no black/white answer to it, you will figure it out. plus our bodies do change over time

 

[normalkev]

Some guys will say that's not enough but it's all about how you react to the compounds and what your goals are.

You should be able to increase your test dose you'll just likely have to take an AI if you are prone to gyno. My TRT dose is 100mg week and that puts my total Test in the 600-700 range. If I go even up to 200-250mg I need a little AI to keep gyno in check. At 500mg week of test I need 10mg aromasim daily where some guys still don't need any AI at that dose.

Even though your Nandrolone is low you may want caber on hand just in case and running 25mg of Proviron a day would be beneficial.

As far as gains not coming yet, Deca is a long ester so it takes longer to get in your system and start noticing the effects. And with 200mg the gains will be more slow and steady.

Thank you! At 200 test (max I have taken), my gyno seems fine, it’s the crazy emotional issues that make it unbearable without an AI. Good call about the caber, I happen to have some since my thyroid meds raise my prolactin levels. How would the proviron assist? Only thing I know about proviron is it helps lower SHBG.

 

[normalkev]

this is where experience and bloodwork and trial and error come into play. there is no black/white answer to it, you will figure it out. plus our bodies do change over time

Good point. I think I will take a measured approach and see how I react to deca at 200. Maybe next time I will just bump up deca to 300 and keep test the same. My understanding is I just need the aromatization from some test and don’t need to run 1:1 test to deca.

 

[normalkev]

Some guys will say that's not enough but it's all about how you react to the compounds and what your goals are.

You should be able to increase your test dose you'll just likely have to take an AI if you are prone to gyno. My TRT dose is 100mg week and that puts my total Test in the 600-700 range. If I go even up to 200-250mg I need a little AI to keep gyno in check. At 500mg week of test I need 10mg aromasim daily where some guys still don't need any AI at that dose.

Even though your Nandrolone is low you may want caber on hand just in case and running 25mg of Proviron a day would be beneficial.

As far as gains not coming yet, Deca is a long ester so it takes longer to get in your system and start noticing the effects. And with 200mg the gains will be more slow and steady.

Thank you, how about the proviron assist? All I know is it’s mild and used to lower SHBG.

 

[normalkev]

This seems to be something that a lot of people misunderstand and that is increasing the dosages of peds. AAS does not make you grow or put on size, your nutrients will. AAS does other things that compliment the entire process.
the dosage you were on for your testosterone replacement therapy is not too bad however I do not know what your serum looks like or your free test levels.
There is ways to promote more growth by optimizing the amount of free testosterone in your system without increasing your dosages. Free bio test is what you want to focus on. You can simply add something very modest like Masteron E at 200mg E6D, this will help reduce the activity of estrogen by converting your bound testosterone into free usable testosterone, ultimately hijacking exogenous test, this will help lower your shbg levels at the same time controlling the amount of circulating estrogen and the conversion.
It's often mistaken as being called an anti-estrogen, when an actuality it's not really that, it just inhibits the process by a different pathway.
This will amplify your testosterone levels and your output and your sense of well-being. All the while staying within the same markers that you are prescribed.
Higher dosages of testosterone does not necessarily mean greater gains, you could be inviting a slew of unwanted side effects.
One of the number one things that people should focus on more is trying to grow while using as gear as possible. Knowing how to time your nutrients and your macros when your body needs them at the appropriate time is the most important thing of all. You can increase your dosages all day long and still be stuck in the same place, maybe slightly moving the scale because of water retention.
You owe it to yourself with putting this concept into great consideration. What do you have to lose?
If you pull a baseline blood work and then a post blood work running the protocol above I guarantee you'll see a huge difference not only on the analysis but also physically.

I appreciate your detailed response. I had a full panel when I was running 200 test only per week and my free test was 48, shbg was 35 and my total was off the charts. Do you think running test at 170, masteron at 200 and deca at 200 for a future blast would be beneficial? My training and diet are in check as I have been gaining muscle, but I am a little impatient since I’m already in my 40s and don’t have years to make gains like someone in their 20s.

 

[~Vision~]

I appreciate your detailed response. I had a full panel when I was running 200 test only per week and my free test was 48, shbg was 35 and my total was off the charts. Do you think running test at 170, masteron at 200 and deca at 200 for a future blast would be beneficial? My training and diet are in check as I have been gaining muscle, but I am a little impatient since I’m already in my 40s and don’t have years to make gains like someone in their 20s.

Yes I think it would be very beneficial running your T at 170, keep that there just for your body to have balance, let the mast work with the test by allowing your free test to be the workhorse, and the nandrolone will be in the background giving assistance. It won't be aggressive but it will be more than you need. If anything it will be very therapeutic, and you'll feel healthier, you'll feel better, without experiencing overwhelming side effects or even adrenal fatigue. Try to maximize as much as possible on this little dosage, there's plenty of time to ramp it up. See how you respond and keep an eye out for all sensitivities. On your next rodeo if you feel froggy increase it a little bit, this way you can know how you respond by adjusting things in either direction. If you go to aggressively then how would you know what to subtract and what is potentially causing the issue, or potential issues? Some guys like to dive in dick deep, and it's a complete waste. At this dosage start playing with your macros and your timing, and watch how your body responds, you'll totally get what I'm saying here.

 

[normalkev]

Yes I think it would be very beneficial running your T at 170, keep that there just for your body to have balance, let the mast work with the test by allowing your free test to be the workhorse, and the nandrolone will be in the background giving assistance. It won't be aggressive but it will be more than you need. If anything it will be very therapeutic, and you'll feel healthier, you'll feel better, without experiencing overwhelming side effects or even adrenal fatigue. Try to maximize as much as possible on this little dosage, there's plenty of time to ramp it up. See how you respond and keep an eye out for all sensitivities. On your next rodeo if you feel froggy increase it a little bit, this way you can know how you respond by adjusting things in either direction. If you go to aggressively then how would you know what to subtract and what is potentially causing the issue, or potential issues? Some guys like to dive in dick deep, and it's a complete waste. At this dosage start playing with your macros and your timing, and watch how your body responds, you'll totally get what I'm saying here.

Thank you very much! I’ll give that a go. I’m assuming I should run this for 14 weeks, right? Any recommendations on the fast acting ester for mast? I already have pharma grade doc prescribed deca on hand so I am not planning on NPP.

 

[~Vision~]

Thank you very much! I’ll give that a go. I’m assuming I should run this for 14 weeks, right? Any recommendations on the fast acting ester for mast? I already have pharma grade doc prescribed deca on hand so I am not planning on NPP.

12+ weeks is definitely good enough.
It's mild and modest, and ultimately your goals are long-term. By the end of this run whatever you put on will most likely be yours and you earned it. Instead of just packing on some fluff in which you ultimately lose some in the end. If you grind this out, pound-for-pound, you may come out 4-5 lbs and it's all yours.
I'm confident that not only will you look better but you'll feel better. You owe it to yourself to have this experience. Just be patient, and look at the long-term goal. If you're not satisfied at 12+ weeks, the next cycle is on the house ( on me ).
Stay with Mast E, you want a nice slow and steady and stable output. You don't want to be bouncing all over the place.

 

[normalkev]

12+ weeks is definitely good enough.
It's mild and modest, and ultimately your goals are long-term. By the end of this run whatever you put on will most likely be yours and you earned it. Instead of just packing on some fluff in which you ultimately lose some in the end. If you grind this out, pound-for-pound, you may come out 4-5 lbs and it's all yours.
I'm confident that not only will you look better but you'll feel better. You owe it to yourself to have this experience. Just be patient, and look at the long-term goal. If you're not satisfied at 12+ weeks, the next cycle is on the house ( on me ).
Stay with Mast E, you want a nice slow and steady and stable output. You don't want to be bouncing all over the place.

Thank you for the advise. It resonates with me. I’ll keep everyone posted on my progress, including my end results of my current modest 200 mg deca blast.

 

[ElevenBravo77]

Thank you! At 200 test (max I have taken), my gyno seems fine, it’s the crazy emotional issues that make it unbearable without an AI. Good call about the caber, I happen to have some since my thyroid meds raise my prolactin levels. How would the proviron assist? Only thing I know about proviron is it helps lower SHBG.

Proviron has several benefits. A lot of guys run it with Nandrolone and I know plenty of guys who run it with every cycle or even as a standalone. It is liver safe which is a plus.

Nandrolone can metabolize to DHN in the body and a DHT derivative like Proviron is great to combat this. It also has mild ant-estrogenic properties so even if you raise your test dose you may not need aromasin or arimadex.

At 200mg Deca dick likely won't be a problem but a little Proviron can be your safety net. It can increase libido substantially depending on the dose. So if you have a wife/girlfriend she'll either love you or hate you after a few weeks.

Most people just straight up feel better when Proviron is added. It seems to elevate your mood and combat some of the stress and anxiety that other steroids can cause.

 

[normalkev]

Proviron has several benefits. A lot of guys run it with Nandrolone and I know plenty of guys who run it with every cycle or even as a standalone. It is liver safe which is a plus.

Nandrolone can metabolize to DHN in the body and a DHT derivative like Proviron is great to combat this. It also has mild ant-estrogenic properties so even if you raise your test dose you may not need aromasin or arimadex.

At 200mg Deca dick likely won't be a problem but a little Proviron can be your safety net. It can increase libido substantially depending on the dose. So if you have a wife/girlfriend she'll either love you or hate you after a few weeks.

Most people just straight up feel better when Proviron is added. It seems to elevate your mood and combat some of the stress and anxiety that other steroids can cause.

Thank you, what dose would you use?