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Mid cycle bloods, E is high

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undisclosed

Proficient Brother
Brothers. Just did bloods yesterday. E came back at 73. I had been taking doctor prescribed Arimidex (Anastrozole) .5 mg E3D up until I got my Aromasin.

Been taking 10 mg of Asin E3D for the last 4 pins, pinning 100 mg Test E E3D, so about 2 weeks ish.

Why is it high and how to dial in? Increase Asin? Is Asin bunk? Switch back to Adex?

13db395aba0348a77a3127f263887d36.jpg


edb6ec41ac7241389a15e507b79e68f0.jpg
 
stevesmi said:
lower your test and up the AI
Click to expand...
He's on barely over 200mg of test E per week, some guys wouldn't even need an AI at this dose. Not sure how his E got so high at 200mg/week.

OP, what is your BF%? And I hope you wanted to say you took 0.5mg of Arimidex, not 5 mg. If your Aromasin from PSL or a different lab?

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For comparison I was doing 250mg a week of test C trying to dial in my TRT dose. I wasn't running an AI at all... And my E2 was 64...

And I felt like absolute shit.... Anxiety and Manic thoughts borderline depression, sleep was horrible both in quality and quantity.... OP how are you feeling during the day and night????

I'd say maybe he's got some bs adex.... cause it sounds like he's doing in between 250-300 mg a week if not more based on his test level.... greater than 1500 can mean 1501 or 2500... LOL
 
OutlawV2 said:
For comparison I was doing 250mg a week of test C trying to dial in my TRT dose. I wasn't running an AI at all... And my E2 was 64...

And I felt like absolute shit.... Anxiety and Manic thoughts borderline depression, sleep was horrible both in quality and quantity.... OP how are you feeling during the day and night????

I'd say maybe he's got some bs adex.... cause it sounds like he's doing in between 250-300 mg a week if not more based on his test level.... greater than 1500 can mean 1501 or 2500... LOL
Click to expand...

So he had Arimidex prescribed to him by a doctor so I doubt its junk.

He switched to aromasin prior to his last 4 pins and just had his bloodwork done so my guess is that the aromasin is junk and should go back to the arimidex.
 
Ahhhhh you are correct. I missed that part.... Yeah I meant to Asin maybe bunk..... OP Where'd you get it so we know who to avoid...
 
Some people do not respond to aromasin it kill estrogen in many parts of the body but will still keep your e high . I have ran aromasin 3 different times and sources . It never worked for me and arimedix always worked great for me stick with adex


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I would up the aromasin to 12.5EOD and see what happens. Even with the lower dosages of test some people produce more estrogen so I would go that way first. I know of people who are on TRT at 200mg/wk of test and still have to use an AI.


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Your aromasin is fake. No way your estrogen would be that high on only 100mg of test E3D if your aromasin was real
 
undisclosed said:
Brothers. Just did bloods yesterday. E came back at 73. I had been taking doctor prescribed Arimidex (Anastrozole) .5 mg E3D up until I got my Aromasin.

Been taking 10 mg of Asin E3D for the last 4 pins, pinning 100 mg Test E E3D, so about 2 weeks ish.

Why is it high and how to dial in? Increase Asin? Is Asin bunk? Switch back to Adex?

13db395aba0348a77a3127f263887d36.jpg


edb6ec41ac7241389a15e507b79e68f0.jpg
Click to expand...

Undisclosed - are you going to tell us the source of the Asin?


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gashred777 said:
Undisclosed - are you going to tell us the source of the Asin?


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Click to expand...

Bro chem enhanced already posted he bought it from psl....i can't believe that PSL sold him fake shit...no way

- - - Updated - - -

But he did say 10mg e3d...12.5 eod is normal so maybe that's it...id be fucking blown away if it was bunk
 
Hollywood305 said:
Bro chem enhanced already posted he bought it from psl....i can't believe that PSL sold him fake shit...no way

- - - Updated - - -

But he did say 10mg e3d...12.5 eod is normal so maybe that's it...id be fucking blown away if it was bunk
Click to expand...

We don’t know that for sure. I’m running PSL gear and asin right now. I’ll be getting mid-cycle bloodwork done in about a week. I can say this though.....I have no symptoms of high E. No water retention as I’m pretty shredded and have gained minimal weight thus far. Now my diet is super clean and not eating above maintenance, coupled with moderate cardio 5 days per week (goals weren’t to “blow up” on this cycle). I also have zero nipple sensitivity or puffiness. Not saying that all of that tells the whole story.....only bloods will. However, too soon to kill to conclusions about bunk shit without the whole story brother. What I’ve learned so far on this forum.....we only know the part of the story that is told to us......think about that


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Could be a bad batch, or he could be immune to it. I didn't know anyone could be immune AI but I guess it's a possibility. I know morphine doesn't do shit for me. Got in a hospital (long story from my past) with some crazy pain in my hip, turned out I had a bone tumor (it went into remission later and is gone now), got a shot of morphine, didn't help, nothing, nada. They tried it on me a few more times, didn't work so I was on Percocet. Good stuff but almost got hooked up.

Anyways it is a possibility that certain individuals are immune to certain drugs.

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Chemically Enhanced said:
Could be a bad batch, or he could be immune to it. I didn't know anyone could be immune AI but I guess it's a possibility. I know morphine doesn't do shit for me. Got in a hospital (long story from my past) with some crazy pain in my hip, turned out I had a bone tumor (it went into remission later and is gone now), got a shot of morphine, didn't help, nothing, nada. They tried it on me a few more times, didn't work so I was on Percocet. Good stuff but almost got hooked up.

Anyways it is a possibility that certain individuals are immune to certain drugs.

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Click to expand...

Are we really banking on he's immune? Come on man? And a bad batch? Arom has got to be the most popular item bought at psl...
I'm really hoping he's underdosing...
How high is 73 anyway? Gyno high?
 
73 is not that bad aromasin kills estrogen in all places in the body and a lot of times still have high estrogen. I prefer adex I’m not into killing estrogen and anytime I ran aromasin the shit never worked and I tried three different sources adex all the way


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undisclosed said:
Brothers. Just did bloods yesterday. E came back at 73. I had been taking doctor prescribed Arimidex (Anastrozole) .5 mg E3D up until I got my Aromasin.

Been taking 10 mg of Asin E3D for the last 4 pins, pinning 100 mg Test E E3D, so about 2 weeks ish.

Why is it high and how to dial in? Increase Asin? Is Asin bunk? Switch back to Adex?

13db395aba0348a77a3127f263887d36.jpg


edb6ec41ac7241389a15e507b79e68f0.jpg
Click to expand...
Asin is not adex. Adex is eod and adjust. The half life of aromasin in men is 8-9hrs. Then your taking only a half dose....instead of ed. Your taking e3d.. Take it ed. 10mg to start now..
Did you do bloodwork before your cycle to see where you were?
If not how do you know if your levels when up or down or didnt move at all?
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/14671195/

- - - Updated - - -

Chemically Enhanced said:
Could be a bad batch, or he could be immune to it. I didn't know anyone could be immune AI but I guess it's a possibility. I know morphine doesn't do shit for me. Got in a hospital (long story from my past) with some crazy pain in my hip, turned out I had a bone tumor (it went into remission later and is gone now), got a shot of morphine, didn't help, nothing, nada. They tried it on me a few more times, didn't work so I was on Percocet. Good stuff but almost got hooked up.

Anyways it is a possibility that certain individuals are immune to certain drugs.

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Click to expand...

There is nothing wrong with the asin. He was taking adex e3d day. Switched to asin half dose but still e3d. Its long without dosing the asin and at half dose. Asin is ment to be taken daily. Not eod or e3d that is adex protocol not asin

- - - Updated - - -

chadmack282 said:
That is what it is Highly recommended to use 1 or 12.5 EOD not e3d.
What is your aromasin source?
Click to expand...

Adex is eod. Due to its long half life.. Asin is not it has a short half life in men 8-9hrs..

- - - Updated - - -

muskate said:
Your aromasin is fake. No way your estrogen would be that high on only 100mg of test E3D if your aromasin was real
Click to expand...

Seriously!!! It isnt fake..
What was his e before this cycle. ??? Anyone??
Also, adex is eod to e3d day not asin. You cannot use a protocol for adex and say hey im gonna run my aromasin the same way!!
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/14671195/
He doesn't need to lower his test he needs to take the asin how it ia meant to be taken. Daily.. Not everyone can get away with running aromasin like adex.. 2 diff ais, 2 diff half lifes, 2 totally different protocols

- - - Updated - - -

ocman said:
That's me 1mg arimidex EOD and my E2 stays around 30 or so...
Click to expand...

Again. Come on people. Adex is not aromasin!
Adex is ran eod. Some even further apart. Some have to even take it at a higher dose and more often than others.
Aromasin is meant to be ran ed. Not eod or e3d and a full dose is 25mg. He is using a half dose ..
 
macedog24 said:
Asin is not adex. Adex is eod and adjust. The half life of aromasin in men is 8-9hrs. Then your taking only a half dose....instead of ed. Your taking e3d.. Take it ed. 10mg to start now..
Did you do bloodwork before your cycle to see where you were?
If not how do you know if your levels when up or down or didnt move at all?
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/14671195/

- - - Updated - - -



There is nothing wrong with the asin. He was taking adex e3d day. Switched to asin half dose but still e3d. Its long without dosing the asin and at half dose. Asin is ment to be taken daily. Not eod or e3d that is adex protocol not asin

- - - Updated - - -



Adex is eod. Due to its long half life.. Asin is not it has a short half life in men 8-9hrs..

- - - Updated - - -



Seriously!!! It isnt fake..
What was his e before this cycle. ??? Anyone??
Also, adex is eod to e3d day not asin. You cannot use a protocol for adex and say hey im gonna run my aromasin the same way!!
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/14671195/
He doesn't need to lower his test he needs to take the asin how it ia meant to be taken. Daily.. Not everyone can get away with running aromasin like adex.. 2 diff ais, 2 diff half lifes, 2 totally different protocols

- - - Updated - - -



Again. Come on people. Adex is not aromasin!
Adex is ran eod. Some even further apart. Some have to even take it at a higher dose and more often than others.
Aromasin is meant to be ran ed. Not eod or e3d and a full dose is 25mg. He is using a half dose ..
Click to expand...

What bothers me most is not one person asked why he is still dosing at e3d as if he was still on adex!! But people are quick to start saying bunk, or it's no good?? Really. !! This again is how bashing and rumors get started!!
It is meant to be taken daily.. Again not one person said take it daily. A half dose, people are saying they take adex at 1mg thats considered a full/ dose. Take the asin ed! I have nothing more to say.

- - - Updated - - -

undisclosed said:
Brothers. Just did bloods yesterday. E came back at 73. I had been taking doctor prescribed Arimidex (Anastrozole) .5 mg E3D up until I got my Aromasin.

Been taking 10 mg of Asin E3D for the last 4 pins, pinning 100 mg Test E E3D, so about 2 weeks ish.

Why is it high and how to dial in? Increase Asin? Is Asin bunk? Switch back to Adex?

13db395aba0348a77a3127f263887d36.jpg


edb6ec41ac7241389a15e507b79e68f0.jpg
Click to expand...

Also, if your levels are over 1500 test. Your on more than 200mg of test e a week? What else are you taking?
 
Very interesting. Looking to see what some of the mods say. I’m taking it EOD now.


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The PK properties of the 25-mg dose showed the highest exemestane concentrations 1 h after administration, indicating rapid absorption. The terminal half-life was 8.9 h. Maximal estradiol suppression of 62 +/- 14% was observed at 12 h.
Pharmacokinetics and dose finding of a potent aromatase inhibitor, ...
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov › pubmed

Following oral administration to healthy postmenopausal women, exemestane is rapidly absorbed. After maximum plasma concentration is reached, levels decline polyexponentially with a mean terminal half-life of about 24 hours.
 
I'm pretty sure it's dose dependent. Maybe it's meant to be taken ED but at the average T doses that would mean taking a 1/4 of a tab, much easier to take 1/2 EOD since most of the tabs have only one notch allowing easy splitting in half without a pill cutter.

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Chemically Enhanced said:
I'm pretty sure it's dose dependent. Maybe it's meant to be taken ED but at the average T doses that would mean taking a 1/4 of a tab, much easier to take 1/2 EOD since most of the tabs have only one notch allowing easy splitting in half without a pill cutter.

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Click to expand...

I don’t follow the math behind a 1/4 tab Chem


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At the end of the day, if taking 12.5mg EOD works for you then keep doing it, if not, as in undisclosed's case, then it needs to be adjusted.

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gashred777 said:
Totally get that bro. But what I’m saying is where did you come up with the 5mg number that would be a 1/4 ED?


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Click to expand...
I'm not saying to take 5mg, macedog mentioned aromasin needs to be takes daily but taking 10 or 12.5 daily may be too much. 12.5 EOD worked fine for me too so if I would have to take it daily, I'd take a 1/4.

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Chemically Enhanced said:
1/4 ED or 1/2 ED. Same idea as taking 400mg of test E once a week or 200mg test E twice weekly.

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Click to expand...
This is flawed thinking. You want stable blood levels. You do not want your e constantly dropping and spiking. You want an even ride so to speak. The same with your test.
Thats why most take their test twice a week. In 2 pins.
Its the same amount(400) but you want to avoid the peaks and valleys. You want nice level /even blood work. If you can do this you will limit your sides.
 
Chemically Enhanced said:
At the end of the day, if taking 12.5mg EOD works for you then keep doing it, if not, as in undisclosed's case, then it needs to be adjusted.

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Click to expand...

Agree with this but when your taking an ai that gives you a few days in between dosing like adex. And say your dosing e3d. Now say you stopped on monday.. Now the next time you take your ai is thursday.. Except it isnt the same coverage. But you dont take another dose for 3 days. So now its sunday. Do you see what im getting at.
 
macedog24 said:
Agree with this but when your taking an ai that gives you a few days in between dosing like adex. And say your dosing e3d. Now say you stopped on monday.. Now the next time you take your ai is thursday.. Except it isnt the same coverage. But you dont take another dose for 3 days. So now its sunday. Do you see what im getting at.
Click to expand...

Mace - you recommend 10mg ED then, correct? I’m going into 5th week of cycle and have only been taking 10 EOD. Was going to get blood work I’m a week....but may get sooner now that this whole thread has come to light.


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gashred777 said:
Mace - you recommend 10mg ED then, correct? I’m going into 5th week of cycle and have only been taking 10 EOD. Was going to get blood work I’m a week....but may get sooner now that this whole thread has come to light.


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Click to expand...
Don't change now, wait for your bloods or do them now to see if it works for you or not, then adjust if needed.

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Chemically Enhanced said:
Don't change now, wait for your bloods or do them now to see if it works for you or not, then adjust if needed.

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Click to expand...

That’s kind of what I was thinking too. I wanted to wait another week to let test levels get closer to peak concentrations before bloods. But.....I would hate to ride out another whole week if E levels are high. What are your thoughts there, Chem?


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If your BP is normal, no itchy nipples and no bloat then most likely your E is in normal range and you could wait for another week.

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macedog24 said:
Agree with this but when your taking an ai that gives you a few days in between dosing like adex. And say your dosing e3d. Now say you stopped on monday.. Now the next time you take your ai is thursday.(half dose 10mg). Except it isnt the same coverage. But you dont take another dose for 3 additional days. So now its sunday. Do you see what im getting at.
Click to expand...

Sorry double post
 
gashred777 said:
Mace - you recommend 10mg ED then, correct? I’m going into 5th week of cycle and have only been taking 10 EOD. Was going to get blood work I’m a week....but may get sooner now that this whole thread has come to light.


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Click to expand...
You may be able to get away with eod dosing. Although i always suggest starting 10mg ed . get blood work done on what you have been doing. Your 5 weeks in. It will show where you stand. Not everyone will get signs of itchy nips or gyno at 70ish e levels. How many people have you seen not have signs say everything is great and then. COme back and show e levels 100+. Im still curious of pin time vs blood draw. Or if he isnt taking more test than stated or something else. Over 1500 is high on 200mg test.
 
macedog24 said:
You may be able to get away with eod dosing. Although i always suggest starting 10mg ed . get blood work done on what you have been doing. Your 5 weeks in. It will show where you stand. Not everyone will get signs of itchy nips or gyno at 70ish e levels. How many people have you seen not have signs say everything is great and then. COme back and show e levels 100+. Im still curious of pin time vs blood draw. Or if he isnt taking more test than stated or something else. Over 1500 is high on 200mg test.
Click to expand...

Well I’ll get bloods this coming Friday. That will be after a full 5 weeks in. I will be pinning Thursday night and taking 10 asin Friday morning probably shortly before bloods in order to stay on the same schedule I’ve been on.


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gashred777 said:
Well I’ll get bloods this coming Friday. That will be after a full 5 weeks in. I will be pinning Thursday night and taking 10 asin Friday morning probably shortly before bloods in order to stay on the same schedule I’ve been on.


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Click to expand...

Good luck homie
 
Chemically Enhanced said:
If your BP is normal, no itchy nipples and no bloat then most likely your E is in normal range and you could wait for another week.

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Click to expand...
This..

You need to gauge things on how YOU feel.. I like my E at 60-64'ish that is where I feel at my best.. These standard text book numbers that say you need to be lower are plain silly, because you can't go by every single person. some guys feel great around 20-30, me I would feel like death..

Also, take your IA the day of your injection, not on the day of bloods because something we need to take into great consideration is the "Cmax" levels, peak plasma vs decline especially after 24-48 hrs of your T serum..There will be a huge shift with all levels and estro conversion, therefore taking the AI the day of bloods will only mitigate conversion from that point on, leaving behind a footprint/estro that's still in circulation, you want to have a better perspective with Cmax ng/mL concentration what is truly going on..You're T serum will be at peak plasma the next day, with that said you need to put aside your protocol timing and test properly, don't test around your dosage timing, that will better assess where you TRULY are..

If you have NO estro related signs that are problematic, than don't fuss.. You sound like a great responder..You're T is impressive at just 200mg, so take into consideration that all levels in the endocrine will raise, and the ratio between your T and E sounds about right..

Take AI the day of injection!
 
undisclosed said:
Brothers. Just did bloods yesterday. E came back at 73. I had been taking doctor prescribed Arimidex (Anastrozole) .5 mg E3D up until I got my Aromasin.

Been taking 10 mg of Asin E3D for the last 4 pins, pinning 100 mg Test E E3D, so about 2 weeks ish.

Why is it high and how to dial in? Increase Asin? Is Asin bunk? Switch back to Adex?

13db395aba0348a77a3127f263887d36.jpg


edb6ec41ac7241389a15e507b79e68f0.jpg
Click to expand...

I also just noticed the ECLIA testing assay on your ESTRO,these are not a very accurate tests, in fact they provide the results rather quick just for a fast snap shot, they are not sensitive or comprehensive.. I would request a LC/MS/MS which is a more detailed report that has less chance of molecule cross-reactivity with other hormones..

I'll explain why, For instance ECLIA vs LC MS-MS; ECLIA Method which is short for "Electrochemiluminescent Immunoassay".. It’s a fast and affordable method to measure total hormones in your blood. Many labs use this method because it’s automatic and doesn’t require too much work on a lab technician’s part, it's simply the standard affordable method done by most clinics for blood tests..It's not reliable or entirely accurate..It's simply just a "standard generic method", fast turn around, nothing more, nothing less...It's simply just a fast,quick snap shot for the moment to give almost instant results, so it's somewhat accurate for that sole purpose when it concerns "Just tell me whats going on now, yes or no"...

LC MS-MS Method is short for "liquid chromatography-mass spectrometry". It’s considered the gold standard method by many researchers in measuring small molecules. Its accuracy and consistency is why the CDC is recommending LC/MS to be the standard method used when testing hormones. Because LC/MS is more sensitive than ECLIA, doctors typically use this method when testing patients with really low levels, and testing individuals such as women and children. While it’s more accurate and sensitive, the LC/MS method is more expensive than ECLIA. And it takes a bit longer to get your results...Always place into great consideration that with the LC MS-MS method it will be more pronounced with measuring specific concentrations..

ECLIA can give a false indication of what levels truly are at..​
 
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