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Slightly leaner? You’re jacked and shredded man
super lean this time How has your training been?
Approved Log My Testosterone Enanthate and Primo cycle Log
- Thread starter willipede
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- biopowerna hog101
super lean this time How has your training been?
Thanks brother, sometimes its hard to tell difference when your looking at yourself everyday.Slightly leaner? You’re jacked and shredded man
How has your training been?
Training has been good, ive got a new love for my upper body days. Have some work to do programming wise on lowers
I feel that i can't push myself as hard as I would like too and still be recovered by the next lower session. Quads are just not handling it, hamstrings are fine and might be able to take more. Considering changing too 3 upper 2 lower days and re-writing my program
When you look at yourself it’s never objective, always will be smaller
happens to me all the time , even during bulkingThe training, would be hot to see some exercises reps sets, I’m sure EVO family members want to see how you getting this shred
Looking lean and mean brother
@willipede solid work right here!
1 day you did 5 sets right? not sure I read that right
Yeah just thought it of as a maintenance day.
My knees are recovering quite nicely so should be ready to hammer again soon
Been leaving out any movements that cause pain as they weren't getting better by me trying to push through
Knees are the big issue for many, including me
you pinning any bpc157?
Not currently, I'm planning on getting a box of bpc, tb500 and ghk-cu
That way im covered for any future incident and it helps with my neck pain and discs
Improved my function probably 60-70 percent when nothing else has. I think another moderate-high dose protocol should get me in A1 condition
That way im covered for any future incident and it helps with my neck pain and discs
Improved my function probably 60-70 percent when nothing else has. I think another moderate-high dose protocol should get me in A1 condition
Bloods are in
As I suspected oestrodial elevated
Had the feeling of low labido, puffy nips, low sex drive, still getting wood but had no desire for women
I did take an aromasin and a nolva when i got home after bloods as I suspected this and symptoms disappeared
Appreciate any feedback on optimising my bloods - e.g lower test, up primo?
Current doses - BiopowRNA
Test e 520mg pw
Primo 480mg pw
As I suspected oestrodial elevated
Had the feeling of low labido, puffy nips, low sex drive, still getting wood but had no desire for women
I did take an aromasin and a nolva when i got home after bloods as I suspected this and symptoms disappeared
Appreciate any feedback on optimising my bloods - e.g lower test, up primo?
Current doses - BiopowRNA
Test e 520mg pw
Primo 480mg pw
@willipede you are another case where blood work clearly shows Primobolan is NOT an effective anti-estrogen for the majority of the guys. How many injections of test enan and primo per week? like did you do 2 or 3 or 5 injections per week split dose?
@AE1079 I was talking about this, blood work over and over show that primobolan is not an effective anti-estrogen and it sure heck isnt an Ai, would peg at best SERM-like low dose.
ALT/AST creatinine t3/t4/tsh and general bloods wbc/rbc etc
start with the basics and we can check from there
I reckon if primo was higher then test we would be in business @Eddie Haskell
But, in saying that some people just need the AI.. my mind is shifting over. Higher aromatase activity in individuals- AI Needed
Those who don’t - Primo/Mast or both..
I’m now sitting at this belief. I would love to see a primo higher then test next.
The issue is how do we know who is higher aromatizing? Honestly I think majority of EVO brothers need an Ai, likely a minority genetic positives has estrogen and Ai chains that dont require it, I venture to guess 10% @AE1079
Pinning schedule is split EOD averaging out to Test e 520mg, Primo 480mg
I am begging to agree with you both that most people actually are a higher aromatisers like myself and alot of people running decent amounts of PEDs would have high e2 if they actually got bloods done
I will for sure have a go at reassessing dosage. Lowering test to 400 and increase primo to 600 - what is your opinion on that change?
I do know from my experience and some I am coaching has reacted well to the higher primo:test ratio being e2 sensitive, it is also dose dependent, higher dose will have more of a influence on E2. It could be that due to the lower dosages it’s just not presenting it’s AI properties via its metabolites.
I’m going to do a deeper dive in my spare time to get a grip of the metabolite it’s self and how we can utilise it.. AIs for some agreed, I just feel like bro we can hopefully avoid use of it in some people.
The primo space is still evolving and something I should’ve noted is it can be dose dependent, I think users using gear in higher doses may benefit more from primo.
If any AI I would stick with Aromasin
I’m not the one to say no here because I advocate it instead of a AI. I have used 800 primo with 600 test and E2 came back in 65 pmol
Instead of increasing primobolan, I would add an Ai eod arimidex or EOD aromasin instead.
You are not going to get anywhere bumping primo at this stage. You need to lower your estrogen asap.
I have aromasin on hand to manage it while it comes down. But I prefer to have a protocol that i know will work without AI
Thats why im thinking lower the test by 100mg and increase primo by 100mg and see where I land in 4 weeks time
Now looking at the blood work and not just replying (my bad)
E2 is high and as badly as I believe in primo being a steady source of aromatase inhibition, I’m going to have to fold here and agree with an AI being needed @Eddie Haskell, there’s no way increasing primo anymore will do anything drastic at this point. Aromasin EOD, start at 12.5mg. If your at almost 300pmol, with primo on the table it’s not going to bring it down by 150 points.. that I can admit
I’m so happy to see you wanting to do test + primo dosing but I’m afraid it’s not going to give you what you need, decreasing the test dose may give you some reduction in E2, upping the primo will give you some reduction in E2 as well, but for where your E2 is at it’s not enough. If your E2 was at like 120-150, sure this is a good approach, but being in high 200s you will need an AI 100%. Start low
In your situation with Estrogen E2 so high, best course is not to play with hormones, stay on the cycle you are on now and add aromasin start low dose 5mgs EOD to feel it out. @willipede
Yes his Estrogen was way too high to manage with primobolan @AE1079
Also something we should discuss is having more EVO brothers do bloodwork during the cycle, not just pre-post. @willipede situation is a great example
Thanks for the input, I was unsure it would have that little impact when changing it by that much
Just had a look at some notes. The last cycle previously ran 400 test with 175 npp and 420 primo felt great no bad sides.
I will definitely start low with aromasin. I actually feel very few side effects and actually was unsure if that e2 result was very far out of an acceptable range during cycle i thought it was only going to be a tad high
I have 12.5mg capsules so not the easiest to split but I will figure something out.
Another question for you guys, if e2 is high but without any noticable side effects is it an issue, should I be doing minimum effective dose of aromasin to resolve symptoms or should I be trying to get it in normal range?
This is a
good question
Your relatively lean - so the excess water retention won’t be as apparent and very minimal effect on the body.
What’s your BP?
High E2 can bind up IGF1, and enable its binding through the liver as it produces lipoprotiens through cholesterol as it’s attached to it. ( binding protien 1) which will see a decrease in both fat loss and muscle gain as this binding protein is primarily responsible for inhibiting growth.
High E2 can also cause more risk for cancers, something to note, may not be necessarily something to worry about but the risk is there.
Erectile dysfunction and gut disturbances as well as changes in brain chemistry, more frontal lobe cortex activation(emotional responses), increased dopamine, serotonin, norepinephrine or even decreases depending on physiological response.
Fibre is really important here to ensure your flushing it out of the body as E2 will bind with the fibre and excrete it, which you should be getting from foods anyway, a fibre supplement does help in individuals who are dieting more then anything.
@AE1079 interesting mention of fiber here, we have always suggested everyone is taking psyllium husk, but reading what you posted this must be mandatory now.
@willipede best way to split the caps is to open, mix into a glass of water (warm) and drink 1/2 and 1/2 roughly 6.x mgs aromasin but you can also take 12.5mgs E3D as your E2 is really high, minimum it would adjust it fast.
You can have high estrogen with no physical sides, that's actually bad as you cant tell. The internal side effects like organ damage, hormonal damage and issues with brain chemistry will be happening no matter how you feel outside.
Just measured BP at home 135/77 a bit higher than I would like
Also just read over the test results again, non-sensitive ELISA assay.
Is this possibly throwing out my test results like some other compounds do or it is still valid. Finding it hard to answer some of these questions when trying to do some self education.
Shouldn’t as your not taking tren, that will read asE2 in some
ELISA Is pretty standard. Whether it’s direct, indirect, sandwich or competitive just affects how it mobilises the antigens and enzymes, may have chopped that a bit, testing my memory hard
I think your overthinking a little about it, which is fair as it shows your interest, but to save your brain from learning the trivial stuff, I can say that it will take some time to learn these things. The body is extremely dynamic, it’s non binary and therefore it will constantly be in flux. I think what is important is you learn your body and how it works.
There is an analogy that Broderick Chavez said and I can completely agree with it. Steroids is like the USB, the body is the computer, you insert the usb into the computer and there will be stored information. What the body does with that information is completely unique, and what’s on that usb is the code - or the specific steroid, which where the code will be uploaded and initiate the program, the body does something similar, it takes the steroid and it goes through the numerous process to reach that nucleus inside our cells, to then spit out the that transcribed androgen/metabolite to then make its way to the receptors. What happens after this in layman’s terms is all genetic dependent, genomic and non genomic effects which creates the reaction we see in our bodies. Which then split into an array of effects physically and mentally.
Learn these effects and observe them. You will connect the dots and learn what works and what doesn’t, through biofeedback, bloodwork and well being.
Hopefully that kinda puts you on the path to where you need to go with it
@willipede just read all the posts back, I agree with both @Eddie Haskell and @AE1079 your play now is an Ai, you can modify doses later.
Lets focus on building more mass.
Update -
Started dosing Aromisin 12.5mg will be doing e3d now that e2 feels back on track.
The pork sword is back in full function, libido up. Feeling back on top again and like a sexual deviant which is great
Lifts feeling more aggressive, some more pbs, feeling leaner, dryer and more vascular.
More updates to come
Started dosing Aromisin 12.5mg will be doing e3d now that e2 feels back on track.
The pork sword is back in full function, libido up. Feeling back on top again and like a sexual deviant which is great
Lifts feeling more aggressive, some more pbs, feeling leaner, dryer and more vascular.
More updates to come
Would be good to get bloods to see the differences as well bro
Any suggestion on time frame should I be looking at for retesting
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If you can retest I would retest 2 weeks post the 1st blood work.
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@willipede strong training today but I can see you careful on knees
For sure, I'm learning my lesson to not push through pain, it goes against my nature bit I know If I let them recover for now I'll be twice as good in future
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You'll even step on stage with your looks, just be safe with injuries.
I am starting to get thoughts of competing in some form so I get more exposure and can become a better coach as I'll be starting up personal training soon and have a love for it.
Just not sure what to do yet I think that will come to me over the next year or so, I think maybe then I will have accumulated enough muscle mass to feel confident size wise in getting on a a stage
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The way you look now, 16 weeks and you can be on stage. @AE1079 preps plenty of guys, you can easily step on stage get a feel for it.
Wow. You're working with some major exercise people.
That's great that he's helping you with activation routines.
That's great that he's helping you with activation routines.
Bro, one way that I like to stretch is friend ties me to the back of truck bumper and then pulls me along the ground.
Cheers brother, just sent him a dm to see what it might take to get me their, thanks for the confidence in me, happy to challenge myself anyway
Definitely happy with the vascularity now, I dont think ill let myself go up in bf% ever again I used to think bulking helped putting on muscle but ever since changing my goals ive improved much quicker and feel better
Have kind of come to the realisation that tendons will get sore and easily damaged when putting on muscle quickly using gear.
Will have to try and use this as a lesson as ive done it enough times that I should know better.
Got a week off the gym due to personal circumstances so will see how everything goes when im back.
Personal training would be awesome.
You certainly have the physique to be a good coach. And the knowledge.
You certainly have the physique to be a good coach. And the knowledge.
Rather than swap in, which is one option, you can do what I do.
1) Rotate through different exercises. It allows you to eek out the last drop
2) Rotate widths, handles etc (works on back esp)
3) Cycle through exercises over the year (3 months on X, 3 on Y etc)
1) Rotate through different exercises. It allows you to eek out the last drop
2) Rotate widths, handles etc (works on back esp)
3) Cycle through exercises over the year (3 months on X, 3 on Y etc)
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@AE1079 check this post please
Got him covered
Super strong foundation man, tendons and ligaments take a beating with the extra force produced.
ensure you take the time to warm up
Core warm ups
Core temperature increase via low steady state cardio for 5 mins - low steady state to warm the whole body up
Targeted movement to ensure the area has plenty of blood and the fascia ready to stretch.
Taking the time to do this preworkout will reduce any injuries 100%
I'm always doing 5 minutes of light cardio to get things going before a session. Then into some dynamic stretches.
Do about 4-5 warm up sets that taper down in reps from 8-1 as I build up to my working weight then couple minutes rest into top heavy set.
Hoping to get another visit at the exercise physiologist before Christmas and hes going to write me a bit of protocol to use before and after Upper and Lower sessions
Cycle modification question
Ive been looking into adding proviron. Have been doing some research on this and listened to @stevesmi and @Mobster podcast. I'm feeling that this will only improve the cycle by letting the test and primo work better
Thinking of starting at 25mg and seeing how i feel possibly going up to 50mg as e2 was quite high, still continue using 12.5mgs of aromasin e3d
Ive been looking into adding proviron. Have been doing some research on this and listened to @stevesmi and @Mobster podcast. I'm feeling that this will only improve the cycle by letting the test and primo work better
Thinking of starting at 25mg and seeing how i feel possibly going up to 50mg as e2 was quite high, still continue using 12.5mgs of aromasin e3d
Great update man. Keep at it
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Glad to see the podcast is giving you ideas
25mg is all you need to do the job. No need to double up
@willipede solid work here bro!
@willipede evo podcasts are great way to gain legit knowledge........
Update from training break
Back home after personal matter, have had a week off training and can tell my knees haven't made a noticeable improvement still.
Have recieved tracking from the peptides so hopefully arriving soon. Ordered bpc-157, tb500, glutathione and some mt-2
Back home after personal matter, have had a week off training and can tell my knees haven't made a noticeable improvement still.
Have recieved tracking from the peptides so hopefully arriving soon. Ordered bpc-157, tb500, glutathione and some mt-2
Welcome back
your knees will get better after bpc tb
Still hasn't arrived recieved tracking but postage is slow coming up to Christmas and auspost is shit at the best of times1 shoulder press set? How’s the feel on it
You use any peptides? Today bpc/tb
Yeah always love my 1 set exercises, people don't see my work up sets before each exercise because I dont really count them as stimulating
I hit shoulder exercises 1 set, 3 days per week. Taking it slow with overhead pressing as I have limited range of motion and more volume causes more harm than good
1 set thats interesting bro
just dont max out
1 set thats interesting bro
Actually responding really well to low volume I don't think ill ever go back to a high volume or bro split ever again.
Have made more progress this year with this training style than ever before. Will be full body or upper lower from now on
low volume that works for manyActually responding really well to low volume I don't think ill ever go back to a high volume or bro split ever again.
Have made more progress this year with this training style than ever before. Will be full body or upper lower from now on
mike mentzer low reps squeeze and get a bit pump @willipede
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@willipede strong training update, how has your macros been?
Honestly wouldn't have a clue. Only eat when im hungry now, as I used to try and bulk and wouldn't put any extra muscle just felt like shit and insulin resistant.
Now that I'm only eating when my body tells me to it's been really easy to get lean and I don't have to make a effort to stay this way.
I'm eating mostly whole foods, been making lamb salads for lunches, eggs on Sourdough for breakfast and meat and veg for dinner
I have a carb meal and coffee before gym sessions on training days. Have a litre of cocobella coconut water during workout to stay hydrated and steady carb source
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you eat what your body tells you? interesting, so you mean you dont know what you're eating at all?
I mean I know what I eat, I don't know how much of each macro I'm hittingyou eat what your body tells you? interesting, so you mean you dont know what you're eating at all?
I assume I'm hitting protein requirements as ive got protein in nearly every meal. Recover okay from workouts and getting stronger
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sure thats a way to do it, vet style
oldschool guys didnt record
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@willipede you look amazing, lean and strong
arms hugechest wide, shoulder big and abs popping hard
Ensure comparison pics are taken under the same conditions
You look fantastic man.
Most people would kill for that physique.
Most people would kill for that physique.
