16 Years Training, Declining Recovery & Low Free T — Considering HGH/Test, Need Insight

[Struman]

Hi everyone

I’ve been working out since I was 16 years old and I’m currently 32. Fitness has been a huge part of my life for as long as I can remember. As a teenager, I was a competitive volleyball player (3x national champion), and over the years I’ve also been deeply involved in cycling, snowboarding, and trail running. That said, lifting weights and being in the fitness industry has always been my true passion too.

I became a trainer in my early 20s, and now have 11 years of coaching experience and about 16 years of consistent training under my belt. I specialize in performance training focusing heavily on anatomy, biomechanics, and applied intensity. I’ve worked with performance athletes and currently own a gym where I coach up to 16 hours a day.

Over the years, I’ve started noticing a gradual decline in recovery and muscular hypertrophy. This is despite doing everything “right” — extremely clean diet (organic, no alcohol, no drugs), structured programming, supplementation, and consistent recovery protocols (massage, sleep optimization, Normatec, Hyperice, lymphatic drainage, etc.). I get blood work done every 3 months.

For context: I’m 6’2”, 197 lbs, around 16% BF. My total testosterone fluctuates between 600–800, but my free testosterone is consistently low (~80). Recently, a health clinic had me on DHEA/pregnenolone for 8 weeks to boost LH/FSH and increase testosterone naturally. Around week 6, I felt terrible, dull, emotionally off, low energy, low libido. I stopped immediately, and within a week I felt back to normal.

Lifestyle-wise, I sleep about 6 hours per night (up at 4am daily), coaching 6–8 sessions a day on top of running my business.

I’ve spent months researching HGH from a physiological and professional standpoint. I’ve gone through threads here, listened to medical professionals and also the “gym bro” side of things, and read extensively about exogenous GH and its effects. At this point, I’m seriously considering it as a tool for recovery, sleep, and overall wellbeing. I understand it’s a long-term commitment and expensive, but I’ve always viewed investing in health (when done responsibly) as worthwhile.

On the testosterone side my clinic is likely going to suggest enclomiphene next week. However, since I’ve already tried something that increased LH/FSH (DHEA/pregnenolone) without meaningful improvements in total/free T and with negative side effects, I’m hesitant to go that route again.

I’ve been considering a testosterone cycle to increase total T and, by extension, free T exogenously. One important factor: I don’t have kids yet, and my wife (27) and I are planning to wait another 2–3 years before trying. Because of that, I’ve also been looking into possibly incorporating HCG to maintain testicular function.

At this point, I feel like I’ve hit a true plateau. I’ve been pushing my body hard for 16 years and likely peaked naturally around 27. Since then, it feels like diminishing returns no matter how dialed in everything is.

I’d really appreciate honest, experience-based opinions on:

• HGH alone vs HGH + Test
• Whether introducing Test makes sense in my situation
• Thoughts on HCG for fertility preservation
• Any alternative approaches I might be overlooking

Appreciate any insight this is something I’m taking seriously and want to approach intelligently.

Thank you

 

[toddthelineman]

Non professional friendly opinion: put that bun in the oven and get your trt/hgh going. Like this afternoon hahaha.

But seriously, you can look through the fertility logs here and you’ll see that’s probably not what you want to go through. Odds are decent that you’ll be able to do it eventually but you’ll be stressed and feeling worse than you do now for months at least.

I have never seen anyone say they took enclomiphine and it was the best thing they ever did. I did just read a log where a fella took it and his test went sky high right along with his e2 and shbg and he felt worse. Then he starting making a bunch of knee jerk reactions and not listening and I stopped reading right there.

You’re probably one of the best candidates for TRT/hgh out there besides the argument that “you don’t need it”. I don’t suppose I needed it either but it’s been a resounding positive in my life. But you? Lifelong fitness lifestyle through and through? Yeah dude. You’re definitely going to get serious benefits, this is what you do.

I’d stick to the hgh until your soldiers successfully storm the castle and then go ahead and do a smart first cycle. Arguably, if you really have to wait 3 years you could risk it for the biscuit and do a cycle soon and do your pct and see how you recover. You will make some kind of recovery I think.

It’s pretty likely that once you do a cycle you’ll want to do another and eventually if not right away start your trt journey. Maybe you have the will and self control of a monk, but you know? Testosterone works. It’s got what you’re looking for. You’re mature enough to do it well. So it’s probably going to be a part of your life once you let it.

 

[Struman]

Appreciate you taking the time to write that out

The fertility piece is honestly the biggest thing giving me pause. I’ve gone down that rabbit hole a bit and yeah… it doesn’t look like something I want to be navigating while also trying to run a business and keep performance high. On the other side I've seen people who've ran Test cycles and have not had any side effects. but it all comes down to various factors and how each individual reacts to it.
I also hear you on the “once you start, it tends to stick” side of things. I’m very aware this likely isn’t a one-and-done decision, which is why I’m trying to be intentional before jumping in and gather as much information as possible just to stay safe.

On the HGH side, I do have an order in that is supposed to arrive these days and I am all set for that, cause I can see the potential benefits, and if I keep the doses low 1-2 IU a day, as a result of my research I have been doing in the last couple of months I think I should be fine with that. But if you do have suggestions please feel free.

The enclomiphene point is interesting too. That’s kind of been my hesitation, numbers going up but not actually feeling better. That’s exactly what I’m trying to avoid.

Definitely appreciate the perspective ,especially from someone who’s been through it.

 

[waggat]

Hi everyone

I’ve been working out since I was 16 years old and I’m currently 32. Fitness has been a huge part of my life for as long as I can remember. As a teenager, I was a competitive volleyball player (3x national champion), and over the years I’ve also been deeply involved in cycling, snowboarding, and trail running. That said, lifting weights and being in the fitness industry has always been my true passion too.

I became a trainer in my early 20s, and now have 11 years of coaching experience and about 16 years of consistent training under my belt. I specialize in performance training focusing heavily on anatomy, biomechanics, and applied intensity. I’ve worked with performance athletes and currently own a gym where I coach up to 16 hours a day.

Over the years, I’ve started noticing a gradual decline in recovery and muscular hypertrophy. This is despite doing everything “right” — extremely clean diet (organic, no alcohol, no drugs), structured programming, supplementation, and consistent recovery protocols (massage, sleep optimization, Normatec, Hyperice, lymphatic drainage, etc.). I get blood work done every 3 months.

For context: I’m 6’2”, 197 lbs, around 16% BF. My total testosterone fluctuates between 600–800, but my free testosterone is consistently low (~80). Recently, a health clinic had me on DHEA/pregnenolone for 8 weeks to boost LH/FSH and increase testosterone naturally. Around week 6, I felt terrible, dull, emotionally off, low energy, low libido. I stopped immediately, and within a week I felt back to normal.

Lifestyle-wise, I sleep about 6 hours per night (up at 4am daily), coaching 6–8 sessions a day on top of running my business.

I’ve spent months researching HGH from a physiological and professional standpoint. I’ve gone through threads here, listened to medical professionals and also the “gym bro” side of things, and read extensively about exogenous GH and its effects. At this point, I’m seriously considering it as a tool for recovery, sleep, and overall wellbeing. I understand it’s a long-term commitment and expensive, but I’ve always viewed investing in health (when done responsibly) as worthwhile.

On the testosterone side my clinic is likely going to suggest enclomiphene next week. However, since I’ve already tried something that increased LH/FSH (DHEA/pregnenolone) without meaningful improvements in total/free T and with negative side effects, I’m hesitant to go that route again.

I’ve been considering a testosterone cycle to increase total T and, by extension, free T exogenously. One important factor: I don’t have kids yet, and my wife (27) and I are planning to wait another 2–3 years before trying. Because of that, I’ve also been looking into possibly incorporating HCG to maintain testicular function.

At this point, I feel like I’ve hit a true plateau. I’ve been pushing my body hard for 16 years and likely peaked naturally around 27. Since then, it feels like diminishing returns no matter how dialed in everything is.

I’d really appreciate honest, experience-based opinions on:

• HGH alone vs HGH + Test
• Whether introducing Test makes sense in my situation
• Thoughts on HCG for fertility preservation
• Any alternative approaches I might be overlooking

Appreciate any insight this is something I’m taking seriously and want to approach intelligently.

Thank you

Hey mate.

To me 32 seems pretty young to be talking about declining recovery etc.

Based on what you've said, I'm pretty confident your issue is long term accumulated fatigue. Training hard and consistently getting only 6 hours sleep is probably not cutting it hey. What is your job like in terms of stress?

 

[toddthelineman]

the HGH side, I do have an order in that is supposed to arrive these days and I am all set for that, cause I can see the potential benefits, and if I keep the doses low 1-2 IU a day

I absolutely love hgh, but I’ve never taken it solo. It felt like such a big jump with all the scare mongering with the fakes out there and acromegaly. But my personal experience is that reasonable doses are mild and subtle, but you just make it a routine and over time you are just more and more amazed. Every so often you’ll just notice something new like “oh I look years younger” or “oh I forgot what it felt like to sleep when I was a teenager, now I remember” and you start to get this unmistakable look, just like when you were a teenager and your stomach is perfectly flat. You know it’s working because you have to cut your finger nails twice a week hahaha.

On the other side I've seen people who've ran Test cycles and have not had any side effects.

For sure! I believe I was 32 when I first dabbled. I did a winstrol only cycle because my supplier was telling me all about what else I needed to do if I wanted to do testosterone or deca and it seemed like more than I wanted to deal with. Guys say Winstrol only is a horrible cycle but if Ben Johnson could win the Olympics with it how bad can it be? It wasn’t bad, but I ran it too long and did shed hair and got joint pain. But I felt like I could crack an anvil with a hammer. I came off with no pct, felt pretty awful for eh, a week or two, and eventually got bigger and stronger than I ever had been even on that cycle. It just took about a year.

Appreciate you taking the time to write that out

I love sharing my experience and perspective. I’m glad you’re here! You’ll get a lot of feedback from plenty more experienced than me

 

[Struman]

Hey mate.

To me 32 seems pretty young to be talking about declining recovery etc.

Based on what you've said, I'm pretty confident your issue is long term accumulated fatigue. Training hard and consistently getting only 6 hours sleep is probably not cutting it hey. What is your job like in terms of stress?

Hey man, appreciate the input.

Yeah, I agree and to be honest I’ve had the same thought in the back of my mind. 32 shouldn't feel like this if everything is truly dialed in. And over the last 2 years I've tried to optimize everything as much as I can to promote better recovery, including optimizing macros and micros and trying to squeeze in as much sleep as I can here and there.

The sleep piece is probably the weakest link if I’m being objective. I’ve been running on ~6 hours for years now, and while I’ve adapted to it mentally, I’m aware how much that’s actually costing me on the recovery/hormonal side.

As for stress, it’s definitely not low. I own a gym and coach pretty much all day, usually up around 4am and going until late afternoon/evening. It’s not just physical, it’s the constant mental engagement, decision making, and being “on” for clients all day. So yeah, probably a decent allostatic load when I step back and look at it.

I think what’s been tricky is that this has been my normal for so long that it’s hard to tell what’s “baseline” vs what’s actually suboptimal and when you're running in constant level of some form of stress both physical and mental, and you cannot help your body via regular pathways, that's when I personally have started looking into exogenous stimulation.

Appreciate you bringing that up

 

[Kopite67]

Hi everyone

I’ve been working out since I was 16 years old and I’m currently 32. Fitness has been a huge part of my life for as long as I can remember. As a teenager, I was a competitive volleyball player (3x national champion), and over the years I’ve also been deeply involved in cycling, snowboarding, and trail running. That said, lifting weights and being in the fitness industry has always been my true passion too.

I became a trainer in my early 20s, and now have 11 years of coaching experience and about 16 years of consistent training under my belt. I specialize in performance training focusing heavily on anatomy, biomechanics, and applied intensity. I’ve worked with performance athletes and currently own a gym where I coach up to 16 hours a day.

Over the years, I’ve started noticing a gradual decline in recovery and muscular hypertrophy. This is despite doing everything “right” — extremely clean diet (organic, no alcohol, no drugs), structured programming, supplementation, and consistent recovery protocols (massage, sleep optimization, Normatec, Hyperice, lymphatic drainage, etc.). I get blood work done every 3 months.

For context: I’m 6’2”, 197 lbs, around 16% BF. My total testosterone fluctuates between 600–800, but my free testosterone is consistently low (~80). Recently, a health clinic had me on DHEA/pregnenolone for 8 weeks to boost LH/FSH and increase testosterone naturally. Around week 6, I felt terrible, dull, emotionally off, low energy, low libido. I stopped immediately, and within a week I felt back to normal.

Lifestyle-wise, I sleep about 6 hours per night (up at 4am daily), coaching 6–8 sessions a day on top of running my business.

I’ve spent months researching HGH from a physiological and professional standpoint. I’ve gone through threads here, listened to medical professionals and also the “gym bro” side of things, and read extensively about exogenous GH and its effects. At this point, I’m seriously considering it as a tool for recovery, sleep, and overall wellbeing. I understand it’s a long-term commitment and expensive, but I’ve always viewed investing in health (when done responsibly) as worthwhile.

On the testosterone side my clinic is likely going to suggest enclomiphene next week. However, since I’ve already tried something that increased LH/FSH (DHEA/pregnenolone) without meaningful improvements in total/free T and with negative side effects, I’m hesitant to go that route again.

I’ve been considering a testosterone cycle to increase total T and, by extension, free T exogenously. One important factor: I don’t have kids yet, and my wife (27) and I are planning to wait another 2–3 years before trying. Because of that, I’ve also been looking into possibly incorporating HCG to maintain testicular function.

At this point, I feel like I’ve hit a true plateau. I’ve been pushing my body hard for 16 years and likely peaked naturally around 27. Since then, it feels like diminishing returns no matter how dialed in everything is.

I’d really appreciate honest, experience-based opinions on:

• HGH alone vs HGH + Test
• Whether introducing Test makes sense in my situation
• Thoughts on HCG for fertility preservation
• Any alternative approaches I might be overlooking

Appreciate any insight this is something I’m taking seriously and want to approach intelligently.

Thank you

Hey brother, much as I would love to advise or help, this definitely is not an area I have either had to deal with or have any significant knowledge in. However whilst my assist is extremely limited, as well as the help from @toddthelineman and @waggat , you are getting,
@LevButlerov @HarleyGuy @Allupfromhere @BeMe @Coolguy @Dreamer @LH5515 are all extremely knowledgeable brothers who can probably give better insight into this for you.
I wish you every success brother and will be reading along with interest

 

[Struman]

Hey brother, much as I would love to advise or help, this definitely is not an area I have either had to deal with or have any significant knowledge in. However whilst my assist is extremely limited, as well as the help from @toddthelineman and @waggat , you are getting,
@LevButlerov @HarleyGuy @Allupfromhere @BeMe @Coolguy @Dreamer @LH5515 are all extremely knowledgeable brothers who can probably give better insight into this for you.
I wish you every success brother and will be reading along with interest

Thanks brother, I discovered this community fairly recently and this kind of support was the reason why I decided to register and be a part of it.
Looking forward to all the feedback and information that will be provided so I can create a safe and effective protocol.
I'll make sure to provide as much information as possible going forward just so anyone else that is dealing with the same issues will have credible information and some sort of a guideline to follow.

 

[BritishCanadian]

whats your shbg level? When test levels are reasonable, but free test is low, that can be a simple fix with boron.

Is hcg monotherapy an option?

 

[Struman]

whats your shbg level? When test levels are reasonable, but free test is low, that can be a simple fix with boron.

Is hcg monotherapy an option?

Currently sitting at 43 nmol/L
As far as HCG that is what I am trying to gather information on based on previous experiences from guys that have done it.

 

[BritishCanadian]

Currently sitting at 43 nmol/L
As far as HCG that is what I am trying to gather information on based on previous experiences from guys that have done it.

My shbg levels are similar, and I did notice a difference with the boron.

Hcg monotherapy is an option, works to a certain degree, and maintains fertility, much easier to start with that, if it doesn't work for you, little harm done.

So that would be my advice, run that till you are done having kids, and then jump on the other stuff if you still need it at that point.

Unfortunately it seems that your problem is burnout, overworked and under rested, which will mess anyone up long term.

 

[Struman]

My shbg levels are similar, and I did notice a difference with the boron.

Hcg monotherapy is an option, works to a certain degree, and maintains fertility, much easier to start with that, if it doesn't work for you, little harm done.

So that would be my advice, run that till you are done having kids, and then jump on the other stuff if you still need it at that point.

Unfortunately it seems that your problem is burnout, overworked and under rested, which will mess anyone up long term.

I hear you on the burnout side, and I don’t disagree. That said, it’s not like I’m falling apart or living an unhealthy lifestyle. Overall, my habits are dialed in, and I’ve been consistent with that for a long time.
At this point, I see it less as “fixing something broken” and more as taking the next step in optimization. I’ve put in 16 years of hard training without relying on anything exogenous just the basics like protein, creatine, and targeted micronutrients based on regular blood work. I’ve always been intentional about that, not just blindly throwing supplements at the wall.
Now I feel like I’ve reached a point where I’m open and honestly curious about what adding something like HGH, and potentially testosterone, could do from a recovery and performance standpoint.
Thanks for the taking the time to provide your opinion, I appreciate it.

 

[Coolguy]

Hi everyone

I’ve been working out since I was 16 years old and I’m currently 32. Fitness has been a huge part of my life for as long as I can remember. As a teenager, I was a competitive volleyball player (3x national champion), and over the years I’ve also been deeply involved in cycling, snowboarding, and trail running. That said, lifting weights and being in the fitness industry has always been my true passion too.

I became a trainer in my early 20s, and now have 11 years of coaching experience and about 16 years of consistent training under my belt. I specialize in performance training focusing heavily on anatomy, biomechanics, and applied intensity. I’ve worked with performance athletes and currently own a gym where I coach up to 16 hours a day.

Over the years, I’ve started noticing a gradual decline in recovery and muscular hypertrophy. This is despite doing everything “right” — extremely clean diet (organic, no alcohol, no drugs), structured programming, supplementation, and consistent recovery protocols (massage, sleep optimization, Normatec, Hyperice, lymphatic drainage, etc.). I get blood work done every 3 months.

For context: I’m 6’2”, 197 lbs, around 16% BF. My total testosterone fluctuates between 600–800, but my free testosterone is consistently low (~80). Recently, a health clinic had me on DHEA/pregnenolone for 8 weeks to boost LH/FSH and increase testosterone naturally. Around week 6, I felt terrible, dull, emotionally off, low energy, low libido. I stopped immediately, and within a week I felt back to normal.

Lifestyle-wise, I sleep about 6 hours per night (up at 4am daily), coaching 6–8 sessions a day on top of running my business.

I’ve spent months researching HGH from a physiological and professional standpoint. I’ve gone through threads here, listened to medical professionals and also the “gym bro” side of things, and read extensively about exogenous GH and its effects. At this point, I’m seriously considering it as a tool for recovery, sleep, and overall wellbeing. I understand it’s a long-term commitment and expensive, but I’ve always viewed investing in health (when done responsibly) as worthwhile.

On the testosterone side my clinic is likely going to suggest enclomiphene next week. However, since I’ve already tried something that increased LH/FSH (DHEA/pregnenolone) without meaningful improvements in total/free T and with negative side effects, I’m hesitant to go that route again.

I’ve been considering a testosterone cycle to increase total T and, by extension, free T exogenously. One important factor: I don’t have kids yet, and my wife (27) and I are planning to wait another 2–3 years before trying. Because of that, I’ve also been looking into possibly incorporating HCG to maintain testicular function.

At this point, I feel like I’ve hit a true plateau. I’ve been pushing my body hard for 16 years and likely peaked naturally around 27. Since then, it feels like diminishing returns no matter how dialed in everything is.

I’d really appreciate honest, experience-based opinions on:

• HGH alone vs HGH + Test
• Whether introducing Test makes sense in my situation
• Thoughts on HCG for fertility preservation
• Any alternative approaches I might be overlooking

Appreciate any insight this is something I’m taking seriously and want to approach intelligently.

Thank you

Morning brother,
I'd highly recommend the test and gh route.
Never used eco but heard it makes you feel terrible.
In terms of fertility you can still have children on cycle or bring back your fertility if need be.
If you want be keep fertility up. Run some hcg alongside.
Start nice and low for your test and gh idk like 150- 200mg a week and 2iu of gh unsure about hcg but I think its 5000iu.
I had my child on cycle. Both @CypherOCE and @Dreamer ran fertility logs with success. So I think you should be fine.
Hope this helps

 

[BritishCanadian]

I hear you on the burnout side, and I don’t disagree. That said, it’s not like I’m falling apart or living an unhealthy lifestyle. Overall, my habits are dialed in, and I’ve been consistent with that for a long time.
At this point, I see it less as “fixing something broken” and more as taking the next step in optimization. I’ve put in 16 years of hard training without relying on anything exogenous just the basics like protein, creatine, and targeted micronutrients based on regular blood work. I’ve always been intentional about that, not just blindly throwing supplements at the wall.
Now I feel like I’ve reached a point where I’m open and honestly curious about what adding something like HGH, and potentially testosterone, could do from a recovery and performance standpoint.
Thanks for the taking the time to provide your opinion, I appreciate it.

I dont have experience with hgh, but maybe hgh +hcg might be a good combo

 

[toddthelineman]

Morning brother,
I'd highly recommend the test and gh route.
Never used eco but heard it makes you feel terrible.
In terms of fertility you can still have children on cycle or bring back your fertility if need be.
If you want be keep fertility up. Run some hcg alongside.
Start nice and low for your test and gh idk like 150- 200mg a week and 2iu of gh unsure about hcg but I think its 5000iu.
I had my child on cycle. Both @CypherOCE and @Dreamer ran fertility logs with success. So I think you should be fine.
Hope this helps

I ran hcg for years. Like my first four years of trt. It doesn’t take much at all. Like 250-500mcg three times a week. It raises your e2, manageable for some not so much for others. Mine was definitely too high but I’ma fairly high aromatizer anyway. It also raises your testosterone even while on trt. So you could be taking like 150mg and have the t levels of someone running 250 or more. I did. Didn’t get a sperm test, but my balls were not any noticeably smaller and I was definitely producing something lmao. Plenty of it. It still shuts down your hpta, even if you take it by itself. If you take it by itself long enough and come off, you will be suppressed just like you took testosterone. Maaaaaybe you’ll bounce back quicker since your testicles remained activated but I don’t think there’s any proof of that.

 

[BritishCanadian]

I ran hcg for years. Like my first four years of trt. It doesn’t take much at all. Like 250-500mcg three times a week. It raises your e2, manageable for some not so much for others. Mine was definitely too high but I’ma fairly high aromatizer anyway. It also raises your testosterone even while on trt. So you could be taking like 150mg and have the t levels of someone running 250 or more. I did. Didn’t get a sperm test, but my balls were not any noticeably smaller and I was definitely producing something lmao. Plenty of it. It still shuts down your hpta, even if you take it by itself. If you take it by itself long enough and come off, you will be suppressed just like you took testosterone. Maaaaaybe you’ll bounce back quicker since your testicles remained activated but I don’t think there’s any proof of that.

I didn't realize it shuts down hpta long term, learning sometging new

 

[toddthelineman]

I didn't realize it shuts down hpta long term, learning sometging new

Yep! It stimulates your testicles directly. LH and fsh will still be undetectable and your hpta will be bypassed. I don’t know that either. I went into all of this thinking I had an easy out. Nope. No such thing.

Stuff like this is why all the YouTubers are so damaging. I heard you could take hcg and avoid shutdown and that was all I had to hear. I took the ball and ran straight into the parking lot. Then I was getting such good results that I thought “I don’t have to stop, why would I?” After a few years reality set in and here I am. No take backsies

 

[CypherOCE]

If you want sperm you’ll need both hCG and hMG OR alternatively get a prescription later on for Gonal F

hCG alone only helps LH and not FSH

 

[LevButlerov]

Hi everyone

I’ve been working out since I was 16 years old and I’m currently 32. Fitness has been a huge part of my life for as long as I can remember. As a teenager, I was a competitive volleyball player (3x national champion), and over the years I’ve also been deeply involved in cycling, snowboarding, and trail running. That said, lifting weights and being in the fitness industry has always been my true passion too.

I became a trainer in my early 20s, and now have 11 years of coaching experience and about 16 years of consistent training under my belt. I specialize in performance training focusing heavily on anatomy, biomechanics, and applied intensity. I’ve worked with performance athletes and currently own a gym where I coach up to 16 hours a day.

Over the years, I’ve started noticing a gradual decline in recovery and muscular hypertrophy. This is despite doing everything “right” — extremely clean diet (organic, no alcohol, no drugs), structured programming, supplementation, and consistent recovery protocols (massage, sleep optimization, Normatec, Hyperice, lymphatic drainage, etc.). I get blood work done every 3 months.

For context: I’m 6’2”, 197 lbs, around 16% BF. My total testosterone fluctuates between 600–800, but my free testosterone is consistently low (~80). Recently, a health clinic had me on DHEA/pregnenolone for 8 weeks to boost LH/FSH and increase testosterone naturally. Around week 6, I felt terrible, dull, emotionally off, low energy, low libido. I stopped immediately, and within a week I felt back to normal.

Lifestyle-wise, I sleep about 6 hours per night (up at 4am daily), coaching 6–8 sessions a day on top of running my business.

I’ve spent months researching HGH from a physiological and professional standpoint. I’ve gone through threads here, listened to medical professionals and also the “gym bro” side of things, and read extensively about exogenous GH and its effects. At this point, I’m seriously considering it as a tool for recovery, sleep, and overall wellbeing. I understand it’s a long-term commitment and expensive, but I’ve always viewed investing in health (when done responsibly) as worthwhile.

On the testosterone side my clinic is likely going to suggest enclomiphene next week. However, since I’ve already tried something that increased LH/FSH (DHEA/pregnenolone) without meaningful improvements in total/free T and with negative side effects, I’m hesitant to go that route again.

I’ve been considering a testosterone cycle to increase total T and, by extension, free T exogenously. One important factor: I don’t have kids yet, and my wife (27) and I are planning to wait another 2–3 years before trying. Because of that, I’ve also been looking into possibly incorporating HCG to maintain testicular function.

At this point, I feel like I’ve hit a true plateau. I’ve been pushing my body hard for 16 years and likely peaked naturally around 27. Since then, it feels like diminishing returns no matter how dialed in everything is.

I’d really appreciate honest, experience-based opinions on:

• HGH alone vs HGH + Test
• Whether introducing Test makes sense in my situation
• Thoughts on HCG for fertility preservation
• Any alternative approaches I might be overlooking

Appreciate any insight this is something I’m taking seriously and want to approach intelligently.

Thank you

welcome to the EVO family @Struman thank you for sharing with us!
With total T 600-800 and low free T, your biggest lever is lifestyle, 6 hours sleep and coaching 16 hours ed will crush recovery no matter what you run, and throwing HGH or a test cycle on top won’t fix that.
HGH can help sleep and recovery for some guys, but it is not a shortcut for a burned out nervous system, and fertility planning means you need to be very careful with any testosterone use and HCG strategy.

Before you change anything, start a proper log for 2 weeks with daily sleep hours, training loads, steps, calories and macros, stress, and recovery markers, and post your full labs including SHBG, albumin, sensitive e2, prolactin, thyroid, and lipids.
Once the EVO family sees the real day to day, you’ll get a clear answer on HGH only vs adding test and how to handle fertility without guessing. 15min of your time

HOW-TO LOG?

Why is a Log Journal important?

• Doing a log will actually help you way more than just dropping random updates. When you lay it all out week by week you start to see patterns in your body that you won’t catch otherwise.
• Other guys here run logs all the time and there’s no privacy issue, nobody is asking for your name or anything personal, it is just training, diet, and how the compound feels.
• The feedback you get is also way better because people can follow along and spot things you might miss. It also helps the next guy who is thinking about running the same compound so you are giving back while you learn.
• Even if you think you might not stick with it, just starting the log makes it easier to come back and add quick notes. That way you get more out of what you are running instead of keeping it all in your head.

To really guide you we need more info from you:

• Please share your diet, training, cardio, sleep, supplements etc log with us in a NEW thread, full log journal so our guidance is based on facts you provide.
• It will take 15-20 minutes max.
• We have 100s of years of experience between us, so you need to post a LOG Journal with your stats (weight,height,age, years training, cycle history) diet, training, cardio, supplement, sleep details. If you don't log what you eat or train now, open NOTES on phone and start recording it there and paste here. Very easy.
• Please post a Log Journal asap for us

Please click the anabolic forum
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/forums/anabolic-steroids-and-peds.2/
top RIGHT, you see: +POST THREAD
click that

in Title: write your cycle name, like> My _____ Cycle Log
___ = the name of your log
example: My lifestyle training cycle Log
in body: write your planned cycle or cycle you doing now, your diet, training and we will help you along on your cycle

here are examples of LOG Journals
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/first-testosterone-cycle-log.104133/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/sustanon-trenomast-deca-dbol-cycle-journal.105881/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/s-gentz-2025-26-growth-phase-log-with-psl.106514/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...var-bpc157-beligas-pharmaqo-cycle-log.104843/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...g-log-sponsored-by-purity-source-labs.103669/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...erone-cycle-and-beginner-training-log.106310/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/average-trt-back-to-savage-cycle-journal.106252
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...-testosterone-masteron-primobolan-deca.105348
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...odybuilding-log-masters-55-competitor.102611/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...ron-npp-tren-anadrol-log-to-stage-2025.102590

P.S. are you listening to our podcast? if not, you should; this podcast is about steroids, sarms, peptides, and bodybuilding:
https://www.evolutionary.org/podcasts/
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/evolutionary-bodybuilding-radio/id1798623410
https://open.spotify.com/show/53q1RFTgG4h6TQHsJ4xY6Z

 

[Struman]

welcome to the EVO family @Struman thank you for sharing with us!
With total T 600-800 and low free T, your biggest lever is lifestyle, 6 hours sleep and coaching 16 hours ed will crush recovery no matter what you run, and throwing HGH or a test cycle on top won’t fix that.
HGH can help sleep and recovery for some guys, but it is not a shortcut for a burned out nervous system, and fertility planning means you need to be very careful with any testosterone use and HCG strategy.

Before you change anything, start a proper log for 2 weeks with daily sleep hours, training loads, steps, calories and macros, stress, and recovery markers, and post your full labs including SHBG, albumin, sensitive e2, prolactin, thyroid, and lipids.
Once the EVO family sees the real day to day, you’ll get a clear answer on HGH only vs adding test and how to handle fertility without guessing. 15min of your time

HOW-TO LOG?

Why is a Log Journal important?

• Doing a log will actually help you way more than just dropping random updates. When you lay it all out week by week you start to see patterns in your body that you won’t catch otherwise.
• Other guys here run logs all the time and there’s no privacy issue, nobody is asking for your name or anything personal, it is just training, diet, and how the compound feels.
• The feedback you get is also way better because people can follow along and spot things you might miss. It also helps the next guy who is thinking about running the same compound so you are giving back while you learn.
• Even if you think you might not stick with it, just starting the log makes it easier to come back and add quick notes. That way you get more out of what you are running instead of keeping it all in your head.

To really guide you we need more info from you:

• Please share your diet, training, cardio, sleep, supplements etc log with us in a NEW thread, full log journal so our guidance is based on facts you provide.
• It will take 15-20 minutes max.
• We have 100s of years of experience between us, so you need to post a LOG Journal with your stats (weight,height,age, years training, cycle history) diet, training, cardio, supplement, sleep details. If you don't log what you eat or train now, open NOTES on phone and start recording it there and paste here. Very easy.
• Please post a Log Journal asap for us

Please click the anabolic forum
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/forums/anabolic-steroids-and-peds.2/
top RIGHT, you see: +POST THREAD
click that

in Title: write your cycle name, like> My _____ Cycle Log
___ = the name of your log
example: My lifestyle training cycle Log
in body: write your planned cycle or cycle you doing now, your diet, training and we will help you along on your cycle

here are examples of LOG Journals
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/first-testosterone-cycle-log.104133/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/sustanon-trenomast-deca-dbol-cycle-journal.105881/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/s-gentz-2025-26-growth-phase-log-with-psl.106514/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...var-bpc157-beligas-pharmaqo-cycle-log.104843/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...g-log-sponsored-by-purity-source-labs.103669/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...erone-cycle-and-beginner-training-log.106310/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/average-trt-back-to-savage-cycle-journal.106252
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...-testosterone-masteron-primobolan-deca.105348
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...odybuilding-log-masters-55-competitor.102611/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...ron-npp-tren-anadrol-log-to-stage-2025.102590

P.S. are you listening to our podcast? if not, you should; this podcast is about steroids, sarms, peptides, and bodybuilding:
https://www.evolutionary.org/podcasts/
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/evolutionary-bodybuilding-radio/id1798623410
https://open.spotify.com/show/53q1RFTgG4h6TQHsJ4xY6Z

Appreciate it man, thank you, glad to be here
That’ll actually be pretty easy for me to put together. I’m very statistically oriented, so I already track a lot of that. I’ve got all my workouts pre-programmed for the next two weeks, and I also have the last two weeks fully recorded, so I can include that for context as well.
I’ll start organizing everything, sleep, training load, steps, nutrition, stress, recovery markers and pull together my full labs with SHBG, albumin, sensitive E2, prolactin, thyroid, and lipids.
Makes sense to get a clear picture before making any decisions.
Appreciate the guidance

 

[BeMe]

Hi everyone

I’ve been working out since I was 16 years old and I’m currently 32. Fitness has been a huge part of my life for as long as I can remember. As a teenager, I was a competitive volleyball player (3x national champion), and over the years I’ve also been deeply involved in cycling, snowboarding, and trail running. That said, lifting weights and being in the fitness industry has always been my true passion too.

I became a trainer in my early 20s, and now have 11 years of coaching experience and about 16 years of consistent training under my belt. I specialize in performance training focusing heavily on anatomy, biomechanics, and applied intensity. I’ve worked with performance athletes and currently own a gym where I coach up to 16 hours a day.

Over the years, I’ve started noticing a gradual decline in recovery and muscular hypertrophy. This is despite doing everything “right” — extremely clean diet (organic, no alcohol, no drugs), structured programming, supplementation, and consistent recovery protocols (massage, sleep optimization, Normatec, Hyperice, lymphatic drainage, etc.). I get blood work done every 3 months.

For context: I’m 6’2”, 197 lbs, around 16% BF. My total testosterone fluctuates between 600–800, but my free testosterone is consistently low (~80). Recently, a health clinic had me on DHEA/pregnenolone for 8 weeks to boost LH/FSH and increase testosterone naturally. Around week 6, I felt terrible, dull, emotionally off, low energy, low libido. I stopped immediately, and within a week I felt back to normal.

Lifestyle-wise, I sleep about 6 hours per night (up at 4am daily), coaching 6–8 sessions a day on top of running my business.

I’ve spent months researching HGH from a physiological and professional standpoint. I’ve gone through threads here, listened to medical professionals and also the “gym bro” side of things, and read extensively about exogenous GH and its effects. At this point, I’m seriously considering it as a tool for recovery, sleep, and overall wellbeing. I understand it’s a long-term commitment and expensive, but I’ve always viewed investing in health (when done responsibly) as worthwhile.

On the testosterone side my clinic is likely going to suggest enclomiphene next week. However, since I’ve already tried something that increased LH/FSH (DHEA/pregnenolone) without meaningful improvements in total/free T and with negative side effects, I’m hesitant to go that route again.

I’ve been considering a testosterone cycle to increase total T and, by extension, free T exogenously. One important factor: I don’t have kids yet, and my wife (27) and I are planning to wait another 2–3 years before trying. Because of that, I’ve also been looking into possibly incorporating HCG to maintain testicular function.

At this point, I feel like I’ve hit a true plateau. I’ve been pushing my body hard for 16 years and likely peaked naturally around 27. Since then, it feels like diminishing returns no matter how dialed in everything is.

I’d really appreciate honest, experience-based opinions on:

• HGH alone vs HGH + Test
• Whether introducing Test makes sense in my situation
• Thoughts on HCG for fertility preservation
• Any alternative approaches I might be overlooking

Appreciate any insight this is something I’m taking seriously and want to approach intelligently.

Thank you

Have you considered the possibility you're crashing your testosterone from overtraining? Is it possible to dial things back a bit and see if your body responds. You might have just reached a point in your life where you can't redline so hard anymore.

On the GH front I've had great success running only 2iu a day pre-bed. I was running it a month on and then cycling off for a few days but lately I've been trying 5 days on 2 days off with some decent results.

 

[Struman]

Have you considered the possibility you're crashing your testosterone from overtraining? Is it possible to dial things back a bit and see if your body responds. You might have just reached a point in your life where you can't redline so hard anymore.

On the GH front I've had great success running only 2iu a day pre-bed. I was running it a month on and then cycling off for a few days but lately I've been trying 5 days on 2 days off with some decent results.

I’ve had periods where I deliberately reduced my training volume and intensity to prioritize recovery. During those weeks, I trained three times per week for about 60 minutes per session, keeping most sets at 2–4 reps in reserve (RIR) and allowing for longer rest intervals between sets. Outside of training, I focused on improving recovery by taking occasional midday naps, staying active with light walks on the weekends, and making a conscious effort to eat more and get sufficient sleep.

What results are you noticing from being on GH ?

 

[LevButlerov]

Appreciate it man, thank you, glad to be here
That’ll actually be pretty easy for me to put together. I’m very statistically oriented, so I already track a lot of that. I’ve got all my workouts pre-programmed for the next two weeks, and I also have the last two weeks fully recorded, so I can include that for context as well.
I’ll start organizing everything, sleep, training load, steps, nutrition, stress, recovery markers and pull together my full labs with SHBG, albumin, sensitive E2, prolactin, thyroid, and lipids.
Makes sense to get a clear picture before making any decisions.
Appreciate the guidance

since you have it all will be easy to start a log EVO family support your way lets do this! @Struman

 

[Mobster]

@stevesmi maybe a podcast guest?

 

[Struman]

Thanks to everyone for your opinion and support, I'm working on the log and should have it up later today.

 

[BeMe]

I’ve had periods where I deliberately reduced my training volume and intensity to prioritize recovery. During those weeks, I trained three times per week for about 60 minutes per session, keeping most sets at 2–4 reps in reserve (RIR) and allowing for longer rest intervals between sets. Outside of training, I focused on improving recovery by taking occasional midday naps, staying active with light walks on the weekends, and making a conscious effort to eat more and get sufficient sleep.

What results are you noticing from being on GH ?

That's good that you take that time. You should try doing some bloodwork after taking one of those recovery focused weeks and get a better idea of where your actual test levels are at.

GH improved sleep quality and all recovery metrics. I'm big on tracking and really do all I can to improve recovery because like you I love to redline...but I'm 41 sooo I gotta try extra hard lol.

I track with a whoop strap and Garmin watch and I have an eight sleep bed that also tracks my sleep. I feel like I recover a lot better since adding the GH but I have the data to support that feeling

 

[Nasser1997o2]

Injectable L-Carnitine 600mg a day
HGH 2 ius a day
Reta at a low enough dose to still eat, but get the increased insulin sensitivity and better glucose paritioning - Maybe 1mg

Run that until you're done having kids and then hop on test and welcome to the big show, champ.