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Feedback on long-term bodybuilding plan

blitzkreigboy

V.I.P.
EVO Logger
Hey everyone,

Planning a long-term roadmap and want to get some feedback from the pros. My background: 20, 63kg/5' 10", skinny-fat ectomorph, natty for 14 months, started 250mg test enanthate/week in early September, bumping to 375mg/week soon, committed to blast and cruise. My goal is first to reach a Zyzz-level physique in ~3–4 years and then push mass.

I’m thinking of structuring it like a series of sigmoids / parabolas
Curve 1: Twig → Zyzz-level (~3–4 years)
Months 1–6: Blow-up → visible gym-bro
Months 7–30: steep hypertrophy, lean gains
Months 31–36: consolidation, low-dose cruise, lab normalization

Curve 1 in detail:
"Cycle" 1
Months 1-6: Aggressive bulk
Months 7-9: recomp
Months 10-12: cruise

"Cycle" 2
Months 13-15: blast 1
Months 16-18: cruise 1
Months 19-21: blast 2
Months 22-24 : cruise 2

"Cycle" 3
Months 25-29: blast 3
Months 30-32: cruise 3
Months 33-36: recomp
Repeat cycle 2 and 3 for ~2 more years depending on what the mirror says.
In any point in time mirror+labs > calendar

Does this growth curve / phase approach make sense for long-term progression?
Would appreciate some help with planning the PED logic (compound selection per phase) and lab schedules.

Of course yes, I could walk out of the house, get hit by a car (or a heart attack mid-workout) and die, but just laying the sketch out. :)
 
Hey everyone,

Planning a long-term roadmap and want to get some feedback from the pros. My background: 20, 63kg/5' 10", skinny-fat ectomorph, natty for 14 months, started 250mg test enanthate/week in early September, bumping to 375mg/week soon, committed to blast and cruise. My goal is first to reach a Zyzz-level physique in ~3–4 years and then push mass.

I’m thinking of structuring it like a series of sigmoids / parabolas
Curve 1: Twig → Zyzz-level (~3–4 years)
Months 1–6: Blow-up → visible gym-bro
Months 7–30: steep hypertrophy, lean gains
Months 31–36: consolidation, low-dose cruise, lab normalization

Curve 1 in detail:
"Cycle" 1
Months 1-6: Aggressive bulk
Months 7-9: recomp
Months 10-12: cruise

"Cycle" 2
Months 13-15: blast 1
Months 16-18: cruise 1
Months 19-21: blast 2
Months 22-24 : cruise 2

"Cycle" 3
Months 25-29: blast 3
Months 30-32: cruise 3
Months 33-36: recomp
Repeat cycle 2 and 3 for ~2 more years depending on what the mirror says.
In any point in time mirror+labs > calendar

Does this growth curve / phase approach make sense for long-term progression?
Would appreciate some help with planning the PED logic (compound selection per phase) and lab schedules.

Of course yes, I could walk out of the house, get hit by a car (or a heart attack mid-workout) and die, but just laying the sketch out. :)
This plan is not good. You are much too young to be using gear. Your body/brain have not developed yet. By your own admission you are skinny fat/twig. That is not a starting place. You have 0 base. You are just renting muscle now.
You may also want to pick another role model as your guy died at 22yo from a heart attack. Not a great path to follow.
Get off gear and PCT. Build a solid base over the next few years and then think about gear. If you had BB genetics I would take a different stand here but you clearly don't. Do the smart thing here.
 
This plan is not good. You are much too young to be using gear. Your body/brain have not developed yet. By your own admission you are skinny fat/twig. That is not a starting place. You have 0 base. You are just renting muscle now.
You may also want to pick another role model as your guy died at 22yo from a heart attack. Not a great path to follow.
Get off gear and PCT. Build a solid base over the next few years and then think about gear. If you had BB genetics I would take a different stand here but you clearly don't. Do the smart thing here.
Thanks for the feedback, I get where you’re coming from. I’ve been studying this stuff seriously and have a doctor on hand for bloodwork — not jumping blindly. I've planned to blast and cruise, no cycling now that I've seen what borderline supra-testosterone levels can do to my (once crippled) mental health. TRT or death.

Just mapping out a 3-year long-term plan with gradual improvements and medical oversight. I respect your take and I’m here to learn how to do it smart, not reckless.

If you had to give one key principle for building a sustainable base before touching any more gear what would that be? ( I won't be coming off test no matter what happens)
 
you had to give one key principle for building a sustainable base before touching any more gear what would that be? ( I won't be coming off test no matter what happens
You’re not building a base on gear. You’re renting muscle. You’re nowhere near your genetic limit. This is a slow game. It takes manh years of hard training and eating f to grow. You have put in almost no work.
I have zero advice except what has already been said.
 
Hey everyone,

Planning a long-term roadmap and want to get some feedback from the pros. My background: 20, 63kg/5' 10", skinny-fat ectomorph, natty for 14 months, started 250mg test enanthate/week in early September, bumping to 375mg/week soon, committed to blast and cruise. My goal is first to reach a Zyzz-level physique in ~3–4 years and then push mass.

I’m thinking of structuring it like a series of sigmoids / parabolas
Curve 1: Twig → Zyzz-level (~3–4 years)
Months 1–6: Blow-up → visible gym-bro
Months 7–30: steep hypertrophy, lean gains
Months 31–36: consolidation, low-dose cruise, lab normalization

Curve 1 in detail:
"Cycle" 1
Months 1-6: Aggressive bulk
Months 7-9: recomp
Months 10-12: cruise

"Cycle" 2
Months 13-15: blast 1
Months 16-18: cruise 1
Months 19-21: blast 2
Months 22-24 : cruise 2

"Cycle" 3
Months 25-29: blast 3
Months 30-32: cruise 3
Months 33-36: recomp
Repeat cycle 2 and 3 for ~2 more years depending on what the mirror says.
In any point in time mirror+labs > calendar

Does this growth curve / phase approach make sense for long-term progression?
Would appreciate some help with planning the PED logic (compound selection per phase) and lab schedules.

Of course yes, I could walk out of the house, get hit by a car (or a heart attack mid-workout) and die, but just laying the sketch out. :)
welcome to the EVO family :D @blitzkreigboy
Your phase setup makes sense on paper but needs refining before it can work properly for long-term growth. At 63 kg and 5’10” you should focus on building mass 1st through higher training frequency with sets for 4–5 sets of 6–10 reps while holding protein high over 300 grams (YES!)

We need more info about your training split, macros, and current bloodwork including e2 and total test to know if 375 mg test is justified or just bloat risk.

Start a detailed log so we can track weekly bodyweight, lifts, and diet changes to set up your blast and cruise structure in real time. It’ll also make planning your compound progression far more accurate.

HOW-TO LOG?

Why is a Log Journal important?

  • Doing a log will actually help you way more than just dropping random updates. When you lay it all out week by week you start to see patterns in your body that you won’t catch otherwise.
  • Other guys here run logs all the time and there’s no privacy issue, nobody is asking for your name or anything personal, it is just training, diet, and how the compound feels.
  • The feedback you get is also way better because people can follow along and spot things you might miss. It also helps the next guy who is thinking about running the same compound so you are giving back while you learn.
  • Even if you think you might not stick with it, just starting the log makes it easier to come back and add quick notes. That way you get more out of what you are running instead of keeping it all in your head.

To really guide you we need more info from you:
  • Please share your diet, training, cardio, sleep, supplements etc log with us in a NEW thread, full log journal so our guidance is based on facts you provide.
  • It will take 15-20 minutes max.
  • We have 100s of years of experience between us, so you need to post a LOG Journal with your stats (weight,height,age, years training, cycle history) diet, training, cardio, supplement, sleep details. If you don't log what you eat or train now, open NOTES on phone and start recording it there and paste here. Very easy.
  • Please post a Log Journal asap for us

Please click the anabolic forum
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/forums/anabolic-steroids-and-peds.2/
top RIGHT, you see: +POST THREAD
click that

in Title: write your cycle name, like> My _____ Cycle Log
___ = the name of your log
example: My pre-cycle Training Log
in body: write your planned cycle or cycle you doing now, your diet, training and we will help you along on your cycle

here are examples of LOG Journals
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/first-testosterone-cycle-log.104133/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/sustanon-trenomast-deca-dbol-cycle-journal.105881/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/s-gentz-2025-26-growth-phase-log-with-psl.106514/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...var-bpc157-beligas-pharmaqo-cycle-log.104843/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...g-log-sponsored-by-purity-source-labs.103669/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...erone-cycle-and-beginner-training-log.106310/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/average-trt-back-to-savage-cycle-journal.106252
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...-testosterone-masteron-primobolan-deca.105348
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...odybuilding-log-masters-55-competitor.102611/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...ron-npp-tren-anadrol-log-to-stage-2025.102590

P.S. are you listening to our podcast? if not, you should; this podcast is about steroids, sarms, peptides, and bodybuilding:
https://www.evolutionary.org/podcasts/
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/evolutionary-bodybuilding-radio/id1798623410
https://open.spotify.com/show/53q1RFTgG4h6TQHsJ4xY6Z

P.P.S. download our eBooks and learn more:
https://irongorillas.com
 
welcome to the EVO family :D @blitzkreigboy
Your phase setup makes sense on paper but needs refining before it can work properly for long-term growth. At 63 kg and 5’10” you should focus on building mass 1st through higher training frequency with sets for 4–5 sets of 6–10 reps while holding protein high over 300 grams (YES!)

We need more info about your training split, macros, and current bloodwork including e2 and total test to know if 375 mg test is justified or just bloat risk.

Start a detailed log so we can track weekly bodyweight, lifts, and diet changes to set up your blast and cruise structure in real time. It’ll also make planning your compound progression far more accurate.

HOW-TO LOG?

Why is a Log Journal important?

  • Doing a log will actually help you way more than just dropping random updates. When you lay it all out week by week you start to see patterns in your body that you won’t catch otherwise.
  • Other guys here run logs all the time and there’s no privacy issue, nobody is asking for your name or anything personal, it is just training, diet, and how the compound feels.
  • The feedback you get is also way better because people can follow along and spot things you might miss. It also helps the next guy who is thinking about running the same compound so you are giving back while you learn.
  • Even if you think you might not stick with it, just starting the log makes it easier to come back and add quick notes. That way you get more out of what you are running instead of keeping it all in your head.

To really guide you we need more info from you:
  • Please share your diet, training, cardio, sleep, supplements etc log with us in a NEW thread, full log journal so our guidance is based on facts you provide.
  • It will take 15-20 minutes max.
  • We have 100s of years of experience between us, so you need to post a LOG Journal with your stats (weight,height,age, years training, cycle history) diet, training, cardio, supplement, sleep details. If you don't log what you eat or train now, open NOTES on phone and start recording it there and paste here. Very easy.
  • Please post a Log Journal asap for us

Please click the anabolic forum
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/forums/anabolic-steroids-and-peds.2/
top RIGHT, you see: +POST THREAD
click that

in Title: write your cycle name, like> My _____ Cycle Log
___ = the name of your log
example: My pre-cycle Training Log
in body: write your planned cycle or cycle you doing now, your diet, training and we will help you along on your cycle

here are examples of LOG Journals
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/first-testosterone-cycle-log.104133/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/sustanon-trenomast-deca-dbol-cycle-journal.105881/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/s-gentz-2025-26-growth-phase-log-with-psl.106514/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...var-bpc157-beligas-pharmaqo-cycle-log.104843/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...g-log-sponsored-by-purity-source-labs.103669/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...erone-cycle-and-beginner-training-log.106310/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/average-trt-back-to-savage-cycle-journal.106252
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...-testosterone-masteron-primobolan-deca.105348
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...odybuilding-log-masters-55-competitor.102611/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...ron-npp-tren-anadrol-log-to-stage-2025.102590

P.S. are you listening to our podcast? if not, you should; this podcast is about steroids, sarms, peptides, and bodybuilding:
https://www.evolutionary.org/podcasts/
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/evolutionary-bodybuilding-radio/id1798623410
https://open.spotify.com/show/53q1RFTgG4h6TQHsJ4xY6Z

P.P.S. download our eBooks and
welcome to the EVO family :D @blitzkreigboy
Your phase setup makes sense on paper but needs refining before it can work properly for long-term growth. At 63 kg and 5’10” you should focus on building mass 1st through higher training frequency with sets for 4–5 sets of 6–10 reps while holding protein high over 300 grams (YES!)

We need more info about your training split, macros, and current bloodwork including e2 and total test to know if 375 mg test is justified or just bloat risk.

Start a detailed log so we can track weekly bodyweight, lifts, and diet changes to set up your blast and cruise structure in real time. It’ll also make planning your compound progression far more accurate.

HOW-TO LOG?

Why is a Log Journal important?

  • Doing a log will actually help you way more than just dropping random updates. When you lay it all out week by week you start to see patterns in your body that you won’t catch otherwise.
  • Other guys here run logs all the time and there’s no privacy issue, nobody is asking for your name or anything personal, it is just training, diet, and how the compound feels.
  • The feedback you get is also way better because people can follow along and spot things you might miss. It also helps the next guy who is thinking about running the same compound so you are giving back while you learn.
  • Even if you think you might not stick with it, just starting the log makes it easier to come back and add quick notes. That way you get more out of what you are running instead of keeping it all in your head.

To really guide you we need more info from you:
  • Please share your diet, training, cardio, sleep, supplements etc log with us in a NEW thread, full log journal so our guidance is based on facts you provide.
  • It will take 15-20 minutes max.
  • We have 100s of years of experience between us, so you need to post a LOG Journal with your stats (weight,height,age, years training, cycle history) diet, training, cardio, supplement, sleep details. If you don't log what you eat or train now, open NOTES on phone and start recording it there and paste here. Very easy.
  • Please post a Log Journal asap for us

Please click the anabolic forum
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/forums/anabolic-steroids-and-peds.2/
top RIGHT, you see: +POST THREAD
click that

in Title: write your cycle name, like> My _____ Cycle Log
___ = the name of your log
example: My pre-cycle Training Log
in body: write your planned cycle or cycle you doing now, your diet, training and we will help you along on your cycle

here are examples of LOG Journals
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/first-testosterone-cycle-log.104133/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/sustanon-trenomast-deca-dbol-cycle-journal.105881/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/s-gentz-2025-26-growth-phase-log-with-psl.106514/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...var-bpc157-beligas-pharmaqo-cycle-log.104843/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...g-log-sponsored-by-purity-source-labs.103669/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...erone-cycle-and-beginner-training-log.106310/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums/threads/average-trt-back-to-savage-cycle-journal.106252
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...-testosterone-masteron-primobolan-deca.105348
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...odybuilding-log-masters-55-competitor.102611/
https://www.evolutionary.org/forums...ron-npp-tren-anadrol-log-to-stage-2025.102590

P.S. are you listening to our podcast? if not, you should; this podcast is about steroids, sarms, peptides, and bodybuilding:
https://www.evolutionary.org/podcasts/
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/evolutionary-bodybuilding-radio/id1798623410
https://open.spotify.com/show/53q1RFTgG4h6TQHsJ4xY6Z

P.P.S. download our eBooks and learn more:
https://irongorillas.com
Thanks @LevButlerov- appreciate the welcome and detailed feedback.
I’ll start a full training and diet log as suggested and include bloodwork details soon.
My goal right now is to build a solid mass base and fine-tune training intensity before planning any future phase.

Thanks again for the resources and structure — I’ll start the log today.
 
Hey everyone,

Planning a long-term roadmap and want to get some feedback from the pros. My background: 20, 63kg/5' 10", skinny-fat ectomorph, natty for 14 months, started 250mg test enanthate/week in early September, bumping to 375mg/week soon, committed to blast and cruise. My goal is first to reach a Zyzz-level physique in ~3–4 years and then push mass.

I’m thinking of structuring it like a series of sigmoids / parabolas
Curve 1: Twig → Zyzz-level (~3–4 years)
Months 1–6: Blow-up → visible gym-bro
Months 7–30: steep hypertrophy, lean gains
Months 31–36: consolidation, low-dose cruise, lab normalization

Curve 1 in detail:
"Cycle" 1
Months 1-6: Aggressive bulk
Months 7-9: recomp
Months 10-12: cruise

"Cycle" 2
Months 13-15: blast 1
Months 16-18: cruise 1
Months 19-21: blast 2
Months 22-24 : cruise 2

"Cycle" 3
Months 25-29: blast 3
Months 30-32: cruise 3
Months 33-36: recomp
Repeat cycle 2 and 3 for ~2 more years depending on what the mirror says.
In any point in time mirror+labs > calendar

Does this growth curve / phase approach make sense for long-term progression?
Would appreciate some help with planning the PED logic (compound selection per phase) and lab schedules.

Of course yes, I could walk out of the house, get hit by a car (or a heart attack mid-workout) and die, but just laying the sketch out. :)
zyzz had top .01% genetics. you can only be as good as your own genetics allow you. at 20 years old the best thing to do is dial in your diet and training with a log
 
Thanks @LevButlerov- appreciate the welcome and detailed feedback.
I’ll start a full training and diet log as suggested and include bloodwork details soon.
My goal right now is to build a solid mass base and fine-tune training intensity before planning any future phase.

Thanks again for the resources and structure — I’ll start the log today.
please write it yourself dont use ai to do it :D we want to talk to you not a ai @blitzkreigboy even if bad grammar all good
 
Hey everyone,

Planning a long-term roadmap and want to get some feedback from the pros. My background: 20, 63kg/5' 10", skinny-fat ectomorph, natty for 14 months, started 250mg test enanthate/week in early September, bumping to 375mg/week soon, committed to blast and cruise. My goal is first to reach a Zyzz-level physique in ~3–4 years and then push mass.

I’m thinking of structuring it like a series of sigmoids / parabolas
Curve 1: Twig → Zyzz-level (~3–4 years)
Months 1–6: Blow-up → visible gym-bro
Months 7–30: steep hypertrophy, lean gains
Months 31–36: consolidation, low-dose cruise, lab normalization

Curve 1 in detail:
"Cycle" 1
Months 1-6: Aggressive bulk
Months 7-9: recomp
Months 10-12: cruise

"Cycle" 2
Months 13-15: blast 1
Months 16-18: cruise 1
Months 19-21: blast 2
Months 22-24 : cruise 2

"Cycle" 3
Months 25-29: blast 3
Months 30-32: cruise 3
Months 33-36: recomp
Repeat cycle 2 and 3 for ~2 more years depending on what the mirror says.
In any point in time mirror+labs > calendar

Does this growth curve / phase approach make sense for long-term progression?
Would appreciate some help with planning the PED logic (compound selection per phase) and lab schedules.

Of course yes, I could walk out of the house, get hit by a car (or a heart attack mid-workout) and die, but just laying the sketch out. :)
It's nice to lay out a blueprint like this, but in reality this is not the way it should be done. Especially when you're at your age and you're new to this.
 
Hey everyone,

Planning a long-term roadmap and want to get some feedback from the pros. My background: 20, 63kg/5' 10", skinny-fat ectomorph, natty for 14 months, started 250mg test enanthate/week in early September, bumping to 375mg/week soon, committed to blast and cruise. My goal is first to reach a Zyzz-level physique in ~3–4 years and then push mass.

I’m thinking of structuring it like a series of sigmoids / parabolas
Curve 1: Twig → Zyzz-level (~3–4 years)
Months 1–6: Blow-up → visible gym-bro
Months 7–30: steep hypertrophy, lean gains
Months 31–36: consolidation, low-dose cruise, lab normalization

Curve 1 in detail:
"Cycle" 1
Months 1-6: Aggressive bulk
Months 7-9: recomp
Months 10-12: cruise

"Cycle" 2
Months 13-15: blast 1
Months 16-18: cruise 1
Months 19-21: blast 2
Months 22-24 : cruise 2

"Cycle" 3
Months 25-29: blast 3
Months 30-32: cruise 3
Months 33-36: recomp
Repeat cycle 2 and 3 for ~2 more years depending on what the mirror says.
In any point in time mirror+labs > calendar

Does this growth curve / phase approach make sense for long-term progression?
Would appreciate some help with planning the PED logic (compound selection per phase) and lab schedules.

Of course yes, I could walk out of the house, get hit by a car (or a heart attack mid-workout) and die, but just laying the sketch out. :)
a 3-4 year time frame is doable. but in the process expect to cause permanent damage. this isn't a smart choice at 20 years old
 
Ronnie Coleman was huge before he started down this path of roids. Maximize your natural limits first.
bros that a good point. they say once you start roids you almost limiting yourself
 
Hey everyone,

Planning a long-term roadmap and want to get some feedback from the pros. My background: 20, 63kg/5' 10", skinny-fat ectomorph, natty for 14 months, started 250mg test enanthate/week in early September, bumping to 375mg/week soon, committed to blast and cruise. My goal is first to reach a Zyzz-level physique in ~3–4 years and then push mass.

I’m thinking of structuring it like a series of sigmoids / parabolas
Curve 1: Twig → Zyzz-level (~3–4 years)
Months 1–6: Blow-up → visible gym-bro
Months 7–30: steep hypertrophy, lean gains
Months 31–36: consolidation, low-dose cruise, lab normalization

Curve 1 in detail:
"Cycle" 1
Months 1-6: Aggressive bulk
Months 7-9: recomp
Months 10-12: cruise

"Cycle" 2
Months 13-15: blast 1
Months 16-18: cruise 1
Months 19-21: blast 2
Months 22-24 : cruise 2

"Cycle" 3
Months 25-29: blast 3
Months 30-32: cruise 3
Months 33-36: recomp
Repeat cycle 2 and 3 for ~2 more years depending on what the mirror says.
In any point in time mirror+labs > calendar

Does this growth curve / phase approach make sense for long-term progression?
Would appreciate some help with planning the PED logic (compound selection per phase) and lab schedules.

Of course yes, I could walk out of the house, get hit by a car (or a heart attack mid-workout) and die, but just laying the sketch out. :)
EVO provides honest feedback because we care. You won't get gear pushed at you here you'll get solid sound advice.

Having said that this first post is in the 'can-not-reply' category for me (not saying that to jab at you) and it's okay because at your age you are punished by social media to consider only the gear and compounds.

Start again and talk only about your diet (in detail) and training you have planned and make the effort to find out your BF% for us. Otherwise talking about steroids is useless because that comes way after, it's not a 'first post' kinda topic.

Otherwise start yourself a log and become part of the EVO family bro, we got you!
 
First thing you need to realize is this is a marathon, not a sprint. It takes a lifelong commitment.
 
I did that today as well lol :P
Haha that's hilarious. I must have went to bed and fell asleep... I woke up and there's the reply unsent just sitting there. I don't even remember not sending it and I reread it thinking jesus I make sense even when I'm half asleep but there was some typos LOL.

That's EVO commitment brother mad respect!
 
Haha that's hilarious. I must have went to bed and fell asleep... I woke up and there's the reply unsent just sitting there. I don't even remember not sending it and I reread it thinking jesus I make sense even when I'm half asleep but there was some typos LOL.

That's EVO commitment brother mad respect!
EVO love your way :D we are grinding it hard @HarleyGuy my brother
 
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